Nothing like a little back door love from Apple.

The quotes do not make him sound pissed, however. The points are well taken. However, it is not an unusual practice. Anyone who has updated their copy of Acrobat Reader only to find Google Toolbar installed knows that companies sneak things in through the update features.

I have actually started making a practice of removing from the registry any update application, including from Apple, Adobe, and Sun. Not only do I not have to worry about back door lovin, I also do not get those stupid update messages anymore.

I'm already pissed when itunes tries to jump on my machine because I have quicktime installed. Now safari?

FOUL Apple! Yellow card.

The only reason I didn't get it is because every single time that damn "updater" pops up, I have to un-check the iTunes/Quicktime and just update the standalone Quicktime.

Why can't I make it stop asking me about the iTunes option? That's as annoying as the Safari thing, just less shady.

I hate when Yahoo does it, I hate when Google does it, and I hate when Apple does it.

And these kind of practices are a big part of why I'm a Linux user now. When I hit the repositories, I get exactly what I selected -- no more, no less.

it wasn't like they didn't ask you if you wanted to install it. They did. besides its a useful web browser. i love it. Thanks Apple.

It's not malware because Safari isn't intended to do bad things to your computer in secret. It is deceptive because the screen says "select the items you want to update" instead of presenting a new install as a new install.

However, I voted who cares. The worst case is you install Safari and don't use it. The best case is you install Safari and win the lottery. Although the very worst case is you install Safari, win the lottery, but you're morbidly obese and confront a string of bad luck that culminates when your plane crashes on a strange island that has a panda bear, a sentient tornado, underground bunkers, hostile others, and a cloying doctor on it who likes to go hiking.

When you install Adobe reader, they try and shove the damned google toolbar down your throat by default.

I do not like Apple one bit.

I don't mind having Safari on my pc, but update software is annoying. I should have realized I was installing it when I installed Safari. *It actually JUST tried to get me to install iTunes* Grrr!

ANyway...sneaky update software is bad advertising. Especially when I have to hunt down where it is to uninstall it.

This is nothing new, other companies have been doing this for a while. Google has partnered with other vendors to push Google desktop or Google Toolbar to your machine, and that also comes checked by default and if you don't pay attention you get it installed on to your machine. At least Apple is pushing it through their own Software Update, Google Desktop got sneaked onto my machine when I was installing something else.

Here's a thought. What if the poor schlub in charge of the updater screwed up his scripts and pushed the update out for everyone instead of just updating current Safari users? I can picture him now, cowering under his desk...

ohcrapohcrapohcrapthebloggersaregonnaragebecauseappleisn'tperfectiamsofiredwho'sgoingtofeedmykidsohcrapohcrapohcrap!

I'm really torn: on one hand it's an effective advertising tool, letting those who might not read the intertubes regularly know that Apple's new browser for the PC is going legit, but on the other hand it does feel like Apple's trying to slip something under the radar. At the end of the day, Apple is, after all, a multi-national corporation with similar interests and goals as other mega-corps: market share rules the day, and if anyone doesn't think that Apple wants to win the game then they're in for a rude awakening.

Yeah, asking people if they want to install software is just so evil...

Give me a break!

It's interesting to me (as an observer, I really have no opinion on this subject) that there are comments from (mac?) users saying this is no big deal.

If Microsoft did this, there would be backlash so big that you would hear about it on CNN.

Just a thought......

Until the number before the point (X.zzz) changes it's not a new version really, it's just an update, generally these Z's don't mean much for software difference. It is also not a required update. Honestly i think what the real problem is is when we have X.zz and the z's are like brand new programs (i.e. Leopard Tiger) That is what the X denomination is for. It's starting to piss me off. I want a standard. z's for updates X's for software changes

Just a FYI X.zz represents like 3.1 or whatever i didn't want to use random numbers. :D

So long as there is an option not to install it I don't see the problem. If you blindly click ok/install on whatever box pops up on your screen your machine will die sooner rather than later. It only takes a second to double check what's going on.

I use OS X and I don't mind Safari, but for AAPL to push that onto users that don't even have Safari installed is not good. M$ does the same thing with IE. Just let me use Firefox!

@MINI Driver: Yes it is. Do you want to install Adobe Photoshop and when updating, all of a sudden your getting Dreamweaver trial downloaded and installed, when you dont even want it.

Its not that Safari is a bad browser (which it absolutely is in comparison to Firefox and Opera), its that your getting software installed that you never wanted. I shouldnt have to uninstall software i never wanted just to update another piece of software. That makes no sense at all, and while its not Malware, it is Annoyingware, just like Quicktime and iTunes. Ill stick with QT Alternative and Anything else as replacements for those two.

Remember, were talking about PC's here, not your Mac where democracy is frowned upon.

This is the second time Apple has overstepped it's bounds. The first time is when they programmed iTunes to automatically convert all your music to .AAC format unless you go into "Advanced Options" and change it to .MP3 yourself. That is a very MS thing to do. Lets keep things free and open dangit!

Fine - try to bundle other products with the intended install. But here's a novel idea; instead of making the default the install the unwanted crap, leave the box vacant, and leave it up to the individual to check it.

Yes, I understand you still have a choice either way, but now you be able to click "OK" all the way through without having to worry about the repercussions.

@Joseph: The difference is that its being done on Windows, which is synonymous with Safari getting updated automatically on OSX. Did you expect them to not update IE whenever there is one? Do you want selective updates on your OS, or would it make alot more sense to update everything on the OS periodically and let the user choose what they ultimately browse with?

installing software this way should be opt-IN not opt-out like everyone seems to be making us do these days!

Updater programs especially annoy me on my carpc when I connect to a 3g network and bloody quicktime tries to install iTunes over a very small pipe.

Oh well. someone give apple a multimillion dollar slap on the wrist as seems to happen most of the time these days.

I think this practice is very annoying but I can see where it has some justifiable uses. Most people use Adobe Reader don't pay a dime to use it, after all it's freeware. So I can see the justification of them scoring a kickback from Google or Ask or whoever to have their Internet Toolbar sneak it's way onto your machine (thu, honestly it's still pretty crappy of them).

In the case of iTunes, Apple makes money off of just about everyone who has it on there computers. Hell, its best feature is the simple way to purchase music, movies and TV shows. So to make the case for them to sneak a copy of Safari onto unsuspecting users is very hard to justify and boarders on 'dickish'

"I 'ice-cream cone' Apple?" That's weird.

Just turn off Apple update, people! run>msconfig>start up crap> apple b/s UNCHECK! REBOOTS! = Happy

I think what is different about the google toolbar or the trail versions with Adobe Reader and the Apple tactic is that they (Adobe) are not calling it an update. They push the options when you install the software for the first time and devote an entire confirm screen to it (rather than a list of things like how quicktime wants to change your file preferences and take over playing every media file by default). The word update suggests that something new for something existing is coming through. But this is just something new that wasn't on your computer already. The USDA has regulations on food labels that differentiate between 'soup' and 'stew' and it's sincerely enforced (because it matters to someone in the marketplace). Apple is going to ruin it for everyone by forcing the situation where updates and installation of software is government regulated.

On a side note, does Safari run in the background even after closing the program like iTunes does? That sounds even a bit more like malware.

he is mad because it means there is another browser that will become commonplace by default and making it harder for them to get market share.

But I am on his side about the annoyance of their software. Quicktime is a PITA and I usually write a script that deletes registry references to it and call it qttask.exe because every time something tries to run quicktime it wants to run an updater or install something.

matt buchanan, your post once again proves you and gizmodo are apple suckers. And for those ppls, who comparing this with 'Microsoft did this with IE' is dumb example. IE is part of Windows, the same way Safari is part of MacOSX. Microsoft or Apple should only auto push update (With installed softs)with their OS only. What apple is doing is WRONG! It's not a matter of 'just uncheck the option' or 'don't install this'. Apple Software Update should only update pre-installed software. Most users don't want Safari that's why they didn't install before but apple's auto push for Safari, when even we don't have safari on our machine is WRONG. PERIOD!

I don't think Apple should be doing that but people really should be checking what they install anyways. I always make sure to read update notes and stuff so I know exactly what's being put on my computer.

No big deal! So what? How is that any different from the offer to install a Google or whoever's toolbar that seems to be so common during new software installs. The toolbar offer comes up pre-checked to do the install by default. Indeed how does this differ from other software installs, say for a new scanner, that tend to dump other vendors software onto your machine as "bonus" applications. Geez just pay attention during the install. Mozilla's CEO is just another waah, waah internet crybaby and needs to cut some deals with other software vendors so Mozilla can pop up as a pre-selected default install when the latest and greatest home office ap or game is installed.

I think you guys are over-analyzing this. Sure it's annoying (I use Macs and PCs on a daily basis, and it annoyed me). Sure it is underhanded. But what they did isn't really that much worse than when any other company does it. It is a problem that takes two seconds to fix. If you don't want stupid messages like that popping up to annoy you, you should uninstall/deactivate the updater and stop wasting your time bitching on here.

@Kingteddybear: As a followup if Mozilla's CEO wants a user base to jump at the chance to install his browser he needs to quit crying long enough to talk to Sony and code Mozilla to run under the PS3's cell processor and OS. The browser on the PS3 is pile of crap code and I bet there isn't a PS3 user that has actually tried to browse the web through the PS3 that would not jump at the chance to have a new browser.

@Denver80203: Absolutely! The fact that I have to deny an update to Quicktime just because Apple wants to foist iTunes on me is both sad and retarded (kind of like if Gary Coleman dropped his ice cream cone).

I would like it if Gizmodo had an option to download and install a Gizmodo browser on my computer so that everything on the web would look like Gizmodo. Is this possible? TIA!!!

its not so much that Safari sucks (dunno i've never used it), but what Apple is doing is pulling a Microsoft move.

its really awesome to watch them grow as a company, who knows, maybe 5-10 years from now they'll be forcing other crap on its users and releasing devolution OS's.

All I'm going to say is that Red Pandas >>> Compases.

Safari isn't supported by a number of web apps I need to use at work for checking my hours, reporting them, etc. and now it tries to sneak in my back door with it's inanimate little compass feet. Next thing you know it'll automatically make itself the default browser.

The nerve!

Even when I am on a Mac running Safari by default, I always use Firefox. Safari offers no advantages over Firefox whatsoever IMHO.

All these people saying "no big deal", "it's been done before", have no f*ing history on the internet. Go back to the days when pop-ups were so common place that Yahoo would snap up crap in your face without a thought. If you say it's just fine for apple to toss whatever the f*k they want on your machine just because you have one app from them, you are also saying that just because you visit MS's website they should be able to popup screens asking to install whatever the hell they want, Visiting ESPN? Well then lets pop something up asking if you want to install sports ticketer 2000 with google assbar and 20 other apps you never wanted. Oh you have assbar? Well check out bowling elves!
This is a slippery slope you dip shits are just all too happy to go down. You're either too young or too stupid to grasp this so I'm not sure why I bother.
Whatever it means I'm glad I have a couple of fine tools at work as a sysadmin.
1. Take away admin rights from you idiots. Try to install weather bug now, twits.
2. Block all executable downloads from internet/email/ etc.

Go home and screw up your own machine. Safari might be dandy but you're 2 steps from a OS reload... trust me.

@sisedi: It's not in there actually. You can get rid of it through Add/Remove Programs though.

As the Mozilla guy said, it's borderline

what's so bad about Safari? i've had it for over a year on my WinXP computer.

Mozilla just got pissed.

I'm smart enough to say no if I don't want to install it. The curious thing is that it installed on my win2k box that supposedly in the first release wasn't compatiable. After it installed, I tried to run it and it never opened. That isn't borderline malware. That is just a horrible deployment package that doesnt check the version of os before installing.

Yoo Giz! You forgot the "f**K off, you guys are Apple fanboys!" alternative in the poll. ;D

@ACDlite:
"It is a problem that takes two seconds to fix. If you don't want stupid messages like that popping up to annoy you, you should uninstall/deactivate the updater and stop wasting your time bitching on here"

As soon as you move out of your mommas basement and she starts calling you because Super Slick Porn Bar has somehow installed itself on her i386 because the machine asked her a question and she just said "yes, sure whatever" -You will change your mind. Walk grandma thought a registry hack, I dare you.

Installed and tested it, yeah its fast, minimalistic, almost perfect. Lack of a home button pissed me off though. Back to IE.

@Akmed: no-one's saying there's anything wrong with it, just that the method of pushing out towards people is very close to how malware is forced onto people.

Try reading the story again.

The insult is the constant default on all these "updates" for installing different programs. Why should I have to do the work in order to relieve myself of their bloatware? The injury is that it's Safari, truly a third rate program on the PC platform.

Example 41: I right click the back button on FF, see the 16 pages I've already been and can slide down and click to whatever page I want. No add-ons needed (there aren't any for the PC platform, by the way), no separate, superfluous menu.

I right click on Safari's back button and, oh yeah, right click isn't exactly what you'd call a "mature concept" in Apple world. Must be too busy working on some multi-touch UI which accelerates the dumbing down of computing while increasing RSI.

mozilla is just attending the john c dvorak school of apple bashing. They just want some media spotlight from the afterglow

@lianna_g: try clicking and holding.

@rdldr1: Safari starts much faster than firefox on my mac, and the page load tests demonstrate Safari loads pages faster... I'd call that an advantage.

@tehronin:

Safari has a home button…

right click the toolbar and choose "customize toolbar"
then drag and drop the icons you want to use.

As for this issue… unless it installs without permission i dont see the problem, how many times would windows users would use the Apple Updater

Personally, having a fresh install of XP recommend multiple [costly] software packages to me upon starting up is worse.

well well well, I remember the days when MicoScreww was the target of despair and anger... the white knights were Apple, Sun, Oracle, Adobe and Google.

Well lookie here.... they were sheep in wolves clothing!!!!!Oh my! the alimighty Buck$$ speaks.... Wake up kiddies, u have been victimized!!!!!!

Google owns your mind, your clicks, and if you are unfortuante, your cell phone number, Apple owns your tunes, Sun... ahhh since they dumped McNeally the whinnie, they got nuthin... and Adobe is flashing you in an old dingy raincoat.

And what is the evil Billy doin?
Tossing billions at health issues around the world. And what is Goog doin? Passing millions to lobbists to protect their monopolistic fantasies!
And Apple...... your music belongs to us!!!!

A fileforum.com search for Quicktime Alternative has made my 'Apple tries to force iTunes onto my machine' issue entirely. I don't agree with that kind of crap in the least, they've just added to it by forcing Safari.

This violates one of the most important internet security rules.

If I want it installed on my computer, I will actively seek out the software. Anything else is a bad idea.

This isn't exactly new for Apple. Just look at Quicktime and iTunes. Unfortunately, it's also one of the places where Google drops the ball too.

I notice a lot of the Apple schmucks don't understand the difference between "Opt-in"