I'm leery of this. I know it's going to be great, but I know how much M$ loves to beta test their stuff on the public. And OLED is a brand new technology. I don't really trust M$ with it.
@Nebetsu: Yeah, it seems like the majority of products fresh off the assembly lines have some sort of quirk. It's the price you pay for wanting it right now.
Does it really matter? Is anybody deciding right this second which music player they're getting that didn't already have their mind made up? Ah, ok. Just checking.
It was inevitable from the start, due to licensing issues between publishers, that Amazon would eventually have to remove a book from its library.
Someone at Amazon must therefore have sat down and wrote a procedure for what would happen in that event. Including the objectionable part of this, deleting every purchased copy of the book from user's devices.
How stupid did that person have to be to not anticipate this response? It's all very predictable, including the eventual apology.
Kindle sales must have tanked in the last 24 hours. If nothing else, maybe that will keep it from happening again.
It sure does scare me when I think of the power they have over my content though. In reality, you're not buying books, you're renting them for an undisclosed amount of time. I trust Amazon, but it would be pretty easy for them to lose that trust doing things like this.
You can't get any more "we totally fucked up" than that, can you? Those sorts of spinless apologies that don't try to make excuses or pass the buck are rare these days.
I'd like to point out something that a lot of people have overlooked. Everyone here is talking about how ebooks should be treated the same as physical property (which I agree with by the way). Well, if these books were sold illegally, then they are, in essence, stolen property. The parallel everyone has been drawing to having these books being deleted is "what if someone broke into your house to take back your real property?". However, the police can in fact, break in peoples houses to retrieve stolen property. Granted, this is usually done with higher value items, but the principle remains the same: If you buy stolen goods, you are legally obligated to turn them over to the police (and good luck getting your money back in the real world).
Now yes, there is an onus on Amazon to make sure that the goods they sell are legit (You don't see wal-mart buying speakers that fell off the back of kmart's truck). And in this regard, they do deserve criticism. However, I don't think that this incident has any Orwellian overtones outside of the books in question. Amazon did what they were legally required to do.
... Does this mean we get those books back? As much as I disagree with what they did, they didn't exactly have another course of action. They had to avoid the courtroom.
@Hi, I'm God: Of course they had other courses of action. When a company screws up, they make amends. They quite easily could have compensated the publisher who DID have the rights rather than punish the innocent consumer. It was Amazon's error, not the error of the person buying the book.
What would that have cost them? $10,000? $50,000? A drop in the bucket compared to the loss of goodwill and horrible PR they just went through.
They also could have e-mailed the consumer begging forgiveness FIRST.
Basic customer service principle - don't punish your best customers.
@Magicant: Well obviously they could have done the removal of the books a little more gently... for example give a message saying something along the lines of "In 10 days this book will be deleted due to legal issues so read if fucking fast"
I'm sure they did pursue settling it with the publisher, but could not reach an agreement. Like Apple and the Beatles.
Side note - The rights to the Beatles were owned by Michael Jackson, correct? So any chance now that he's a goner we get them in the store?
@Hi, I'm God: They should not have removed the books. If that meant taking licks in a settlement with the publisher or even in court, that is better than what they did.
@frigg: With respect, I'm not sure your response is rooted in an understanding of how intellectual property law works. The publisher wasn't asking for more money, they had never granted permission in the first place. That's a pretty egregious legal error on Amazon's part, and to thumb their nose at the IP owner like that would have been much worse than upsetting a few bloggers.
Any lawsuit would have revealed the fact that this mechanism to recall the books existed, and in addition to having to pay a hefty fine or settlement, they undoubtedly would have been ordered to recall the books anyway.
Amazon is still primarily a book company and as such they need to stay in good graces with the publishers and authors who give them their product. Clearly they could have handled this better by communicating with their customers, but any solution would have involved taking the books back.
To me, this underscores why I would never purchase such a device which you pay a substantial sum for, but do not control. I'm glad the issue came up to shine light on why it is foolish to buy a product that is full of DRM and constantly phoning home over a cellular connection.
@Magicant: They may well have had other options, and it may not have been the fault of the buyer, but the buyer still had something they had no right to have and Amazon removed it without harm to the buyer. The buyer was made whole.
We have become so coddled in this society, and so litigious, that we think we deserve to be compensated for every infraction and indignity. If a company makes a mistake when they print a sale price, we insist they honor it even though ethically there us no reason they need to; an honest mistake should be forgiven if there is no harm. So when Amazon catches someone selling something that isn't theirs - the equivalent of stolen property, we expect Amazon to make amends not just by refunding the money, which they did, but by giving consumers even more for that vague feeling of violation that they suffered when they found out the stolen property they bought had to be returned. That seems absurd to me. Sure, Amazon could have handles things better and been more direct with the affected customers, but I think we should not expect them to absorb all the cost and blame for this event, nor should we expect that every affected customer should get a free copy of 1984 and a fruit basket. This has been an unfortunate mess for everyone involved, but I think consumers need to understand the financial and legal implications before they go spouting off about all the hurt they suffered when their illegitimate copy of 1984 was rescinded.
@sixteenth note: Given the mistake, I think Amazon would have been better served to put themselves in a position to be forced to remove the books. The result would not have been as important as how the parties arrived at it.
Amazon's choice to surreptitiously voluntarily remove purchased books was so egregious, the cost of avoiding it would have been worth it. Forced removal and settlement is a fig leaf Amazon could have used for both customers and publishers (along with some new safeguards for IP owners).
Publishers protect their IP, but most have also read "1984," and grok the symbolism of sneaking into people's gadgets in the dark of night and removing words on Wednesday that were there on Tuesday.
@semiquaver: ... also, if you take Jeff Bezos' apology at its word, that it's not just a disingenuous bit of clever PR, he seems to agree that the "solution" (his quotes) was no solution at all, and given the mistake, they should have gone down another path to correct it.
@Nick: My island name is Nicko: You know, the first time I heard that phrase, it was when one of the dads in my Boy Scout Troop brought several rifles (no ammunition) into one of the Church buildings to teach the kids about firearm safety.
And I will always think of that event when someone says that phrase.
The iPhone/Touch is great as a book reader - I use Stanza and read textfiles. Still, this should grow the Kindle format well and let people legally keep up on current titles instead of relying on Project Gutenberg for classics.
I find it's great if you set the background to black, and text to something less than pure white - I like a half-bright aqua color for indoor reading since I used to read books on my Handspring Visor which used the old indigo LCD backlight.
hmm this is pretty smart... get people to kind of like the idea of e-books and then realize..hmm a bigger screen with easier to read text would make this actual worthwhile.. i was thinking about buying one actually cuz of all the college classes which have pdf files... but idk if i can download pdf to the kindle... to google i go
@Linux Chief hardware engineer: actually this will make me buy a kindle. i currently own a sony e-reader and love the reading experience, but i dont always want to carry it. since this iphone app will sync with your kindle, you can basically be reading a book on your kindle, then pick up right where you left off while waiting in line at the post office. if anything, this will promote kindle sales.
09/09/09
09/09/09
M$? Who's tha- ohhh, wait, I get it! It's Microsoft! Because they... have a lot of money...
Good one.
09/09/09
You mean like Apple does?
09/09/09
09/09/09
09/09/09
09/09/09
09/09/09
Does it matter? The timing is horrible. 73.8% to 1.1% market share. Which story do you think the news will pick up?
09/09/09
Does it really matter? Is anybody deciding right this second which music player they're getting that didn't already have their mind made up? Ah, ok. Just checking.
09/09/09
09/09/09
09/09/09
07/23/09
Someone at Amazon must therefore have sat down and wrote a procedure for what would happen in that event. Including the objectionable part of this, deleting every purchased copy of the book from user's devices.
How stupid did that person have to be to not anticipate this response? It's all very predictable, including the eventual apology.
Kindle sales must have tanked in the last 24 hours. If nothing else, maybe that will keep it from happening again.
07/23/09
07/23/09
07/23/09
07/23/09
Now yes, there is an onus on Amazon to make sure that the goods they sell are legit (You don't see wal-mart buying speakers that fell off the back of kmart's truck). And in this regard, they do deserve criticism. However, I don't think that this incident has any Orwellian overtones outside of the books in question. Amazon did what they were legally required to do.
07/23/09
(I still love your product and use it daily)
07/23/09
07/23/09
What would that have cost them? $10,000? $50,000? A drop in the bucket compared to the loss of goodwill and horrible PR they just went through.
They also could have e-mailed the consumer begging forgiveness FIRST.
Basic customer service principle - don't punish your best customers.
07/23/09
I'm sure they did pursue settling it with the publisher, but could not reach an agreement. Like Apple and the Beatles.
Side note - The rights to the Beatles were owned by Michael Jackson, correct? So any chance now that he's a goner we get them in the store?
07/23/09
07/23/09
Any lawsuit would have revealed the fact that this mechanism to recall the books existed, and in addition to having to pay a hefty fine or settlement, they undoubtedly would have been ordered to recall the books anyway.
Amazon is still primarily a book company and as such they need to stay in good graces with the publishers and authors who give them their product. Clearly they could have handled this better by communicating with their customers, but any solution would have involved taking the books back.
To me, this underscores why I would never purchase such a device which you pay a substantial sum for, but do not control. I'm glad the issue came up to shine light on why it is foolish to buy a product that is full of DRM and constantly phoning home over a cellular connection.
07/23/09
We have become so coddled in this society, and so litigious, that we think we deserve to be compensated for every infraction and indignity. If a company makes a mistake when they print a sale price, we insist they honor it even though ethically there us no reason they need to; an honest mistake should be forgiven if there is no harm. So when Amazon catches someone selling something that isn't theirs - the equivalent of stolen property, we expect Amazon to make amends not just by refunding the money, which they did, but by giving consumers even more for that vague feeling of violation that they suffered when they found out the stolen property they bought had to be returned. That seems absurd to me. Sure, Amazon could have handles things better and been more direct with the affected customers, but I think we should not expect them to absorb all the cost and blame for this event, nor should we expect that every affected customer should get a free copy of 1984 and a fruit basket. This has been an unfortunate mess for everyone involved, but I think consumers need to understand the financial and legal implications before they go spouting off about all the hurt they suffered when their illegitimate copy of 1984 was rescinded.
07/23/09
Amazon's choice to surreptitiously voluntarily remove purchased books was so egregious, the cost of avoiding it would have been worth it. Forced removal and settlement is a fig leaf Amazon could have used for both customers and publishers (along with some new safeguards for IP owners).
Publishers protect their IP, but most have also read "1984," and grok the symbolism of sneaking into people's gadgets in the dark of night and removing words on Wednesday that were there on Tuesday.
07/24/09
07/23/09
07/23/09
And I will always think of that event when someone says that phrase.
03/04/09
Reflective paper-like screens = readable for extended periods
03/04/09
@LittleJon:
I find it's great if you set the background to black, and text to something less than pure white - I like a half-bright aqua color for indoor reading since I used to read books on my Handspring Visor which used the old indigo LCD backlight.
03/04/09
03/04/09
There is a free converter to put pdf files onto the kindle, by making them .prc files.
I picked one up for myself for my birthday earlier this month, I love it.
03/04/09
The last reason to buy a kindle just went out the window haha
03/04/09
03/04/09
No, no it didn't.
03/04/09
03/04/09
and there is no way im gonna spend that much just to read books.
Books are full of facts, and therefor have their own agenda.
03/04/09