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Chris Jacob
"Palm has already said that they see the Pre's direct syncing ability as beneficial to iTunes users who want to use media they own wherever, and however, they want."
I expect an FTC investigation of Apple for anti-competitive behavior soon. The "direct blow" reference is for the purposes of establishing the seriousness of the anti-competitive behavior Apple is warning it will take. This is surely not for the purposes of a legitimate business justification other than to block other competing phone operating system and other hardware from gaining muster in the marketplace.
@Samifumi: /sigh please go look up what it means to be "anti-competitive."
Because right now you look like a moron by saying that. Apple is vicious in its protection of it's self, but they really are not anti-competitive.
In this situation, Palm would have to prove that iTunes is the ONLY way you can sync a Palm Pre to the mac, which is just not the case at all. It may be the way PALM wants to do it, but many other companies (Microsoft, RIM) either dont care about making it work with the OSX system or use solutions to syncing their devices developed by third parties.
@newgalactic: Because everyone who got windows got IE, muscling out other browsers. If Apple made similar deals that required iTunes to be included on every smartphone in the Market, Apple would be similarly guilty.
In this case, it's the other way around. Apple isn't muscling its way into the Pre, it's simply saying it doesnt guarantee its software will work with 3rd party hardware. Palm isn't obligated to make sure WebOS works with every phone on the market. Apple isn't obligated to make sure iTunes works with every phone as well.
@newgalactic: Because that's a completly different situation.
Microsoft not only did what frigg said, they also punished any computer vendor that dared to bundle any other browser with their computers, and i belive they were proactively changing stuff in windows so that no other browser would keep up.
There's a difference between the two actions and also between the busines models. Nobody is obligated to support third parties with software designed to work with some hardware. However Microsoft lets you install whatever software you want and it's suposed to work with any computer since they don't make hardware. But it used his dominant position to take out any competition by threatening any of their vendors.
There's nothing illegal about having a monopoly, i might add, also there's nothing illegal about the apple busines model that is also the busines model for any hardware vendor. Just becaous someone thinks it's EVIL or simply doesn't like it doesn't make it so.
If apple were to make OSX incompatible and actively destroy any other music player on the platform or any browser then people would have a point, specially after so many years of leting anyone develop on the OS.
This has nothing to do with purchasing music. It's a matter of using software to transfer music to devices.
As for your statement, people have the right to charge for goods and services, and music is no different. While I don't like the predatory terms of big record labels, I likewise disagree that music should be free. Artists need to eat too, and unless they're widely renowned and very active in the public eye, concerts and donations alone aren't a viable source of funding.
@Zujus: I agree. Computers should be free too. So should cars and houses! And if I decide I like my house after I bought it, MAYBE I'll toss a couple bucks to the builder.
@Lukasz Fabis: Art is something that should happen without want of payment. Sure, they obviously need money, but the best art was created not because the artist wanted the money, but because they wanted the art.
Now, think about painters, or sculptors, or any artist other than a musician. They don't make money until AFTER someone's seen their art, and liked it. I go to an art gallery. If I like their artwork, I give them money, if I don't like it, well, then I don't. Art isn't about money, it's about expression.
@DJJS: You mean like some of the touch screen stuff that Palm took from Xerox and Apple's Newton? (Which was released years before Palm brought anything to the PDA market.)
Because Jon Rubenstein could probably backwards engineer an early generation iPod in his sleep, I would think it's not so easy for Apple to pull the kill switch on the Pre without eating their young.
I bet somewhere in an Apple lab engineers are feverishly dissecting a Pre to figure out how to do more than rattle a Damocles sword.
@Carradine Dies of a Stroke Film at 11: Lite: Thing is Pre (probably on purpose) stuck Apple in a sticky situation, they can stop the pre-syncing by blocking the iPod registartiaon it use,s but that potentiality locks out legit iPod users, or they block the Pre as a Pre, but then there's issue with Apple locking specific hardware out, so you get anti-trust n all that.
@deanbmmv: It isn't anti-trust to lock out other vendor's hardware from using your software... Amazon has just as big of a music collection as Apple does these days, for the same price.
I'm actually a little unimpressed with their weak-ass response here.
At the very least the message should read:
"However, Apple does not provide support for, or test for compatibility with, non-Apple digital media players and, because software changes over time, newer versions of Apple's iTunes software may erase, destroy, delete, or otherwise seriously mangle your non-Apple digital media player's software and/or firmware. Use of such devices with iTunes is done at the users own risk and is contrary to all iTunes software licensing agreements. Apple is not responsible for any resulting damage."
@suland: But that increased iTunes revenue would come at the expense of lost Apple hardware revenue. I don't know the numbers but I would imagine that it's better to cut off the Pre-customers' potential sales than to lose out on iPod/iPhone sales.
@jessedybka: The Palm Pre doesn't play iTunes DRM'd or even non-DRM'd music. So, they're using iTunes to sync your Pre but Apple sees basically NONE of the revenue involved.
Which is why that statement/post has come out from Apple. If they have no money to lose, why should they support others? And they've probably seen an increase in people trying to contact Apple for support.
I understand the whole smartphone war going on right now but wouldn't it be a bad move fore Apple to kill Pre compatibility? what with people being able to sync their music and whatnot from iTunes that just allows for more iTunes Store sales and someone more avidly using their product.
@Polzin: If I remember correctly Apple actually makes most of its money on the hardware side and very little on the iTunes side. So they actually do want to use iTunes to push people to the product not the other way around.
06/17/09
Yeah, good luck with that.
06/17/09
06/17/09
Because right now you look like a moron by saying that. Apple is vicious in its protection of it's self, but they really are not anti-competitive.
In this situation, Palm would have to prove that iTunes is the ONLY way you can sync a Palm Pre to the mac, which is just not the case at all. It may be the way PALM wants to do it, but many other companies (Microsoft, RIM) either dont care about making it work with the OSX system or use solutions to syncing their devices developed by third parties.
06/17/09
06/17/09
In this case, it's the other way around. Apple isn't muscling its way into the Pre, it's simply saying it doesnt guarantee its software will work with 3rd party hardware. Palm isn't obligated to make sure WebOS works with every phone on the market. Apple isn't obligated to make sure iTunes works with every phone as well.
06/17/09
Microsoft not only did what frigg said, they also punished any computer vendor that dared to bundle any other browser with their computers, and i belive they were proactively changing stuff in windows so that no other browser would keep up.
There's a difference between the two actions and also between the busines models. Nobody is obligated to support third parties with software designed to work with some hardware. However Microsoft lets you install whatever software you want and it's suposed to work with any computer since they don't make hardware. But it used his dominant position to take out any competition by threatening any of their vendors.
There's nothing illegal about having a monopoly, i might add, also there's nothing illegal about the apple busines model that is also the busines model for any hardware vendor. Just becaous someone thinks it's EVIL or simply doesn't like it doesn't make it so.
If apple were to make OSX incompatible and actively destroy any other music player on the platform or any browser then people would have a point, specially after so many years of leting anyone develop on the OS.
06/17/09
06/17/09
This has nothing to do with purchasing music. It's a matter of using software to transfer music to devices.
As for your statement, people have the right to charge for goods and services, and music is no different. While I don't like the predatory terms of big record labels, I likewise disagree that music should be free. Artists need to eat too, and unless they're widely renowned and very active in the public eye, concerts and donations alone aren't a viable source of funding.
06/17/09
06/17/09
Now, think about painters, or sculptors, or any artist other than a musician. They don't make money until AFTER someone's seen their art, and liked it. I go to an art gallery. If I like their artwork, I give them money, if I don't like it, well, then I don't. Art isn't about money, it's about expression.
06/17/09
I agree, otherwise you have John Mayer.
06/16/09
06/16/09
Be to much of a dick.
if I remember right, dosen't Palm own some Multi-touch Screens Patent's?
That Clearly Apple is violating?
I love my iPhone3g and ipods but I see no reason, to block the Pre's Sync!
And if problems do happen take it up with Palm not
With apple.
06/16/09
06/16/09
I bet somewhere in an Apple lab engineers are feverishly dissecting a Pre to figure out how to do more than rattle a Damocles sword.
06/16/09
06/16/09
And the bad PR too, if Apple can get bad PR.
06/16/09
06/16/09
At the very least the message should read:
"However, Apple does not provide support for, or test for compatibility with, non-Apple digital media players and, because software changes over time, newer versions of Apple's iTunes software may erase, destroy, delete, or otherwise seriously mangle your non-Apple digital media player's software and/or firmware. Use of such devices with iTunes is done at the users own risk and is contrary to all iTunes software licensing agreements. Apple is not responsible for any resulting damage."
06/16/09
06/16/09
06/16/09
06/16/09
06/16/09
06/16/09
Which is why that statement/post has come out from Apple. If they have no money to lose, why should they support others? And they've probably seen an increase in people trying to contact Apple for support.
06/16/09
06/16/09
06/16/09
06/16/09
06/16/09