Not surprised. I'll put my Sprint fanboy hat on a sec and mention that before I had a data plan my phones simply spat back "You don't has a data plan stoopid!" No charge.
In related news, I know there was some open forum a few months back discussed on PreCentral. The presenter made some jab at cell providers that have the long menus people have to listen to as possibly just there to drive up minutes. The big four simply grinned at him.
Just got hit with this just month. My sister has an HTC with no data plan, and the Internet Explorer button was pressed while it was in her pocket. Now we have a $12.57 charge on our bill that AT&T refuses to refund.
My mom tried to block data from her account, which ended up blocking her from receiving picture texts. So now we're stuck with a 12 dollar charge, and a tough decision between allowing this to happen again or blocking a service that we pay for.
Of course I've experienced this. And of course Verizon will do nothing to ever change this, it's money in the bank for them.
The solution is to get a phone without the Carrier designed OS installed. HTC/Apple/RIM/Palm/Google couldn't care less if you incur data charges. So they tend to not create a UI that has you accidentally logging on at least twice a month.
Point is, you want to avoid conflicts of interest. 1. Don't let your cell carrier design your phones UI. 2. Don't let your media provider build your audio/video hardware.
@newgalactic: Your answer is to get a smartphone then, which is going to almost always have unlimited data since thats the whole point of having one.
Its nothing about conflict of interests. I still have a extremely hard time believing that VZW or any other carrier is really part of some grand scheme to place buttons so that people are inadvertently charged for stuff. They are about increasing data usage yes. One of the ways that they can do that is to make getting to it more convenient to get there and I see nothing wrong with that. If a consumer is constantly butt dialing their way through the prompts and warnings I'd probably put my phone in a different pocket. #datacharges
@tande04: Yeah, the "conflicts-of-interest" point isn't as valid in the case where most of the alternatives involve getting an unlimited data plan. But there has to be some Verizon dumb-phones out there with non-carrier created OS's. Sony-Ericsson? Nokia?
And it's not so much a "Grand Scheme", as much as it is an inflated perception of how often people use VCast/VZWeb in comparison to their phone's address book and voicemail.
@newgalactic: Nokia maybe (there are no SE VZW phones) but I'm 95% sure that even the nokia is just a skin with some extra features and still has all of the normal VZW acquirements.
I don't think that VZW things people use those more (address book is a dedicated key after all on most phones) but they do have a vested interest in making it easy for people to use. No one is going to jump through six menus to get to web or get it now. They'd probably forget why they wanted to go there by the time they got there. #datacharges
@tande04: Well, I guess there's your argument. What you call "making it easy" others call failing to take the steps necessary to prevent unintended charges.
@nutbastard: Its just as much (if not more so) of an issue there. Then you're getting your "card" (or however you're doing pre-paid) sapped faster. I think it would be even worse cause you could end up out of minutes when you didn't expect it and just write it off as poor memory and buy another card. #datacharges
@nutbastard: I can get accidentally charged with prepaid phones. I use one. It's just that the phone instantly tells me how much money was wasted. #datacharges
not here, man. i got t-mo prepaid (no cards) on a nokia shitbrick that isn't even capable of MMS. $100 for 1,000 minutes that dont expire for 1 year means i end up paying about $200-$250 a year for service, and never any erroneous charges. #datacharges
@nutbastard: Well, I mean, the article also assumes that all 87 million users will hit it accidentally several times a month. If you ask me, that assumes all of their customers are stupid and that none of them have data plans. #datacharges
i am pretty sure you could build a legal argument in favor of consumers on this one. and this might be exactly that. some law firm out there is pushing this story to create a public outcry and rally support for some class action suit against krispy kreme doughnuts. cause obviously this isn't verizon's fault, but those pastry boys making all of our fingers fat. #datacharges
So, does the iPhone have an intentional design/programming flaw that nets Roger's and phone internet services revenue as well? I am referencing this potential problem in mobile Safari that was found recently: [www.theregister.co.uk]
As far I'm concerned, it's your fault if you leave that key mapped to the web. Also, I'm suspicious of that charge for attempting to connect. This is Pogue we're talking about, so I take everything he says with a grain of salt. #datacharges
@Nathan Obbards: I had a few different samsug phones with t-mobile in the past. Some of the phones you could configure the mapping for that button, some you couldn't.
But at least with t-mobile, the data was free if I was just browsing their little wallpaper/game store. So I never got hit with a fee. #datacharges
I always reprogram that stupid button shortcut on whatever Verizon phone I get. The only time they get me is that it's usually the first choice under settings & tools, so with my fat fingers, I hit the OK button instead of a down arrow, and get the connect screen. I'm usually pretty quick on hitting the end button, but never checked my bill for this.
The simplest fix would be for a 3 second countdown in order to hit cancel. Of course, we know verizon won't do that. #datacharges
@aThingOrTwo: I swear I've seen this same story on about a dozen blogs so far today. Which isn't unusual, often times tech blogs will pick up stories from each other, but I've never seen such a simultaneous outpouring over something comparatively insignificant.
Makes me think someone's got a PR firm pushing a dirty story, and that makes me feel icky.
@aThingOrTwo: We know all of the carriers do things like this to "accidentally" boost their billing departments (have we ever heard of "texting", people?) - but this is very fishy timing, and to have only Verizon's name listed is a virtual ocean of fishes. #datacharges
@phunnyballs: I don't ever remember this happening, either, back before I had a data plan. In fact, there were times when I scanned through the Get It Now catalog to see if there was anything new, but I wasn't charged anything unless I actually bought something. #datacharges
@CSX321: Yeah I didn't really get the "get it now" part. Its set up like a store. You go in and buy stuff. Its even gives you the normal web store "are you sure" prompts. If your butt is hitting that many buttons at the same time I'd recommend trying another pocket. #datacharges
Interesting stats, but I would be truly interested in seeing a smart phone to compete with BlackBerry in the corporate marketplace. That is where the "real" money is, and as long as RIM is alone with the BES and BlackBerry devices, they will continue to grow in the market place creating some acceptable but hardly overwhelming products.
Apple, on the other hand, is going to have serious competition in the years ahead from Android.
In any case, it is neat to see the market shifting so dramatically in such a relatively short period of time. #smartphonemarketshare
@Monty: How is the "real" money in the corporate marketplace? there are over 100 million people in the US who are potential smartphone users. The potential number of device sales to corporate America can't be more than 20% of that. #smartphonemarketshare
@CraigJ: Well, okay - I exaggerated slightly. That said, the focus in the media and nearly every web site is the iPhone, which is still behind the BlackBerry in sales. It is not because the BlackBerry is a better device - it is because the corporate marketplace has no choice but to stick with it. I would love to see Apple release a corporate iPhone (and server for managing a fleet of iPhones), or an Android entry into the space - but it has not happened. So, as Apple is competing for the consumer marketplace where there are numerous competitors, RIM will continue to have their profit pouring in. Great for those lovely folks in Canada, but maybe not the greatest for innovation in the business world. #smartphonemarketshare
@Monty: What is holding corporate accounts away from iPhone? I could see it before exchange support and remote wipe, but what is the big draw to a blackberry over an iPhone for corporate use now? File editing? Is there decent office support on BB? #smartphonemarketshare
@Monty: IMO...( gulp! ..dont hit me!! ) WinMo phones could have done it ...I think they still have a small chance if they can manage to update their OS and do a little smart advertising ... If you ( not you per say) consider the fact that you can grab a phone with all the aplications needed with out having to shell out money for them...(like BB).... and just go.
My dissatisfaction with BB led me to use a Korean made WinMo phone and it's surprisingly good (for business aplications, and a few other things).... compared to RIM.... what nightmare they were. #smartphonemarketshare
@Justin Paulson: The reason the iPhone is not only not an option for corporate support but is now actively considered Abaddon in slick black is related to the following:
1. Apple made it seem their device locally encrypted information and never told anyone that it did not.
2. Apple lied to Exchange Servers saying it was locally encrypting the data when it was not.
(FYI: These two lies put corporations in litigation peril since they are held to confidentiality agreements and encryption standards, such as national HIPAA regulations. In other words - major problem.)
3. Apple released a patch that was an insignificant fix for problems that "fixed" this little white lie.
4. That "fix" that was not communicated broke all earlier iPhones from being able to connect to properly configured Exchange 2007 servers.
5. Tech departments from all over the world received countless trouble tickets saying their iPhones no longer worked and blamed it on the corporation, not their beloved company in Cupertino.
6. After getting the facts, companies everywhere started denying access to email data (for obvious reasons) to any iPhone devices, many setting it as company policy.
Oh, sure, there are other problems, too - like being able to control what functions of the iPhone are available to staff - being able to remotely destory the data (corporate necessity), being able to push out applications to each device, etc and so on.
I could go on, but you get the idea.. The iPhone is not a corporate device. Not yet, at least, and given the track record, probably not for a long time. #smartphonemarketshare
@Googlo: We have a few staff in our office that love WinMo devices. I do think that WinMo had an opportunity in the business world to compete with RIM, but right now Microsoft is virtually ignored. Unfortunate. #smartphonemarketshare
11/13/09
In related news, I know there was some open forum a few months back discussed on PreCentral. The presenter made some jab at cell providers that have the long menus people have to listen to as possibly just there to drive up minutes. The big four simply grinned at him.
They do it. We fall for it. #datacharges
11/13/09
My mom tried to block data from her account, which ended up blocking her from receiving picture texts. So now we're stuck with a 12 dollar charge, and a tough decision between allowing this to happen again or blocking a service that we pay for.
11/13/09
The solution is to get a phone without the Carrier designed OS installed. HTC/Apple/RIM/Palm/Google couldn't care less if you incur data charges. So they tend to not create a UI that has you accidentally logging on at least twice a month.
Point is, you want to avoid conflicts of interest. 1. Don't let your cell carrier design your phones UI. 2. Don't let your media provider build your audio/video hardware.
...any others? #datacharges
11/13/09
Its nothing about conflict of interests. I still have a extremely hard time believing that VZW or any other carrier is really part of some grand scheme to place buttons so that people are inadvertently charged for stuff. They are about increasing data usage yes. One of the ways that they can do that is to make getting to it more convenient to get there and I see nothing wrong with that. If a consumer is constantly butt dialing their way through the prompts and warnings I'd probably put my phone in a different pocket. #datacharges
11/13/09
And it's not so much a "Grand Scheme", as much as it is an inflated perception of how often people use VCast/VZWeb in comparison to their phone's address book and voicemail.
11/13/09
I don't think that VZW things people use those more (address book is a dedicated key after all on most phones) but they do have a vested interest in making it easy for people to use. No one is going to jump through six menus to get to web or get it now. They'd probably forget why they wanted to go there by the time they got there. #datacharges
11/13/09
To-mA-to vs. To-Ma-to #datacharges
11/13/09
11/13/09
And I should read other people's comments too lest I sound like a parrot.
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not here, man. i got t-mo prepaid (no cards) on a nokia shitbrick that isn't even capable of MMS. $100 for 1,000 minutes that dont expire for 1 year means i end up paying about $200-$250 a year for service, and never any erroneous charges. #datacharges
11/13/09
11/13/09
"This design "flaw" might be netting Verizon $300 million per year."
then the article says:
"That's over $300 million per month"
month? year? #datacharges
11/13/09
11/13/09
Both Pogue's post and consumerists puts it in months...
Which I find even harder to believe. #datacharges
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As far I'm concerned, it's your fault if you leave that key mapped to the web. Also, I'm suspicious of that charge for attempting to connect. This is Pogue we're talking about, so I take everything he says with a grain of salt. #datacharges
11/13/09
But at least with t-mobile, the data was free if I was just browsing their little wallpaper/game store. So I never got hit with a fee. #datacharges
11/13/09
11/13/09
So whatever phones are involved in this, well, they aren't configured for My Verizon on the 'up'. #datacharges
11/13/09
The simplest fix would be for a 3 second countdown in order to hit cancel. Of course, we know verizon won't do that. #datacharges
11/13/09
11/13/09
Makes me think someone's got a PR firm pushing a dirty story, and that makes me feel icky.
11/13/09
11/13/09
If it were a PR move. Its a pretty shitty one. #datacharges
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Apple, on the other hand, is going to have serious competition in the years ahead from Android.
In any case, it is neat to see the market shifting so dramatically in such a relatively short period of time. #smartphonemarketshare
11/13/09
11/13/09
11/13/09
11/13/09
My dissatisfaction with BB led me to use a Korean made WinMo phone and it's surprisingly good (for business aplications, and a few other things).... compared to RIM.... what nightmare they were. #smartphonemarketshare
11/13/09
1. Apple made it seem their device locally encrypted information and never told anyone that it did not.
2. Apple lied to Exchange Servers saying it was locally encrypting the data when it was not.
(FYI: These two lies put corporations in litigation peril since they are held to confidentiality agreements and encryption standards, such as national HIPAA regulations. In other words - major problem.)
3. Apple released a patch that was an insignificant fix for problems that "fixed" this little white lie.
4. That "fix" that was not communicated broke all earlier iPhones from being able to connect to properly configured Exchange 2007 servers.
5. Tech departments from all over the world received countless trouble tickets saying their iPhones no longer worked and blamed it on the corporation, not their beloved company in Cupertino.
6. After getting the facts, companies everywhere started denying access to email data (for obvious reasons) to any iPhone devices, many setting it as company policy.
Oh, sure, there are other problems, too - like being able to control what functions of the iPhone are available to staff - being able to remotely destory the data (corporate necessity), being able to push out applications to each device, etc and so on.
I could go on, but you get the idea.. The iPhone is not a corporate device. Not yet, at least, and given the track record, probably not for a long time. #smartphonemarketshare
11/13/09