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I'm surprised nobody asked the following yet:
-What real evidence did they have to think the laptop was a bomb?
-Why didn't they x-ray it?
-What's wrong with simply disassembling it with a robot or something? Less of a risk of "taking people's shit for no reason and shooting it."
-Has she filed an official complaint to the government? If I were here, I'd make a huge fucking deal of it.
@Phatric: It's one of the ways, not the smartest, but it can work. It's the same principle as the disrupters (water slugs) that they use on suspect bombs.
Brief explanation on disrupters from NOVA: "the slug of water which it projects bursts in all directions, and it tends to burst the bomb open from the inside. The idea, remember, is not to set the bomb off. It's to knock it apart, so you can gather up the components, but not to cause the bomb itself to explode. And out comes the pin."
@iheartpie: It can create shorts though. In all honesty, very few explosives will be set off by the heat generated by a bullet and very few bullets will actually spark when hitting a target. Most modern explosives are very stable and require either an explosive charge or electrical charge to detonate them. Shotguns and rifles are sometimes used to neutralize ordnance. The point is to try to rapidly separate the detonator from the explosive, the risk is just reduced when using a water slug.
@BlackYoshi: It's also used for vehicle interdiction. In the case of long range ordnance disposal, they use an explosive round.
Why on earth did she leave her bag unattended? To be honest i dont blame the authorities for takign this action. I also sont think that she deserves to be reimbursed as its sheer stupidity leaving anyting in an airport unattended.
@ShadowX:
She was instructed to do so. Either one person told her to leave it there while she was being questioned, and someone else reported it as being suspicious, or they told her to leave it there specifically so they could collect and shoot her laptop.
Nine times out of ten it's an electric razor, but every once in a while... it's a dildo. Of course it's company policy never to, imply ownership in the event of a dildo... always use the indefinite article a dildo, never your dildo.
There has to be a part of the story she's keeping to her self, knowing the Israeli Government isn't going to explain it's side of the story to anyone, and if they do, it most likely won't make the news over here in the states.
So um, what exactly does firing at suspicious luggage even accomplish? If it had ignitable explosives in it, wouldn't that set them off? Isn't that the complete opposite of what they'd want to do?
@The Anti-Fanboy: A common misconception is that the bullet causes things to ignite.
What actually causes the explosion when a bullet pierces a propane tank is not the heat of the bullet, but any sparks created by hitting the metal canister. It is well documented that gas cans have been shot leaving nothing more than two holes in the can itself.
If it had explosives in it, the bullets were very unlikely to set it off. Still, I don't see the reasoning behind shooting the thing either.
@Jon:
Exactly. In fact, a full metal gas tank should be more likely to just leak after being shot, as liquid gasoline is not explosively flammable (it's the gasoline vapors that combust).
@Purple Dave: Please be aware that when I say Gas i mean actual gas - propane, butane etc. I'm from the UK! Sorry for the confusion. Same applies though.
@Jon:
Ah, yes. Well, there are actually differences in the way they'd behave. A gasoline tank won't blow up on its own. A propane or butane tank could, if the physical structure is breached in the right way, explode even if it doesn't combust. That explosion could cause bits of the tank to spark against each other, which would then lead to post-explosion combustion. This would never happen with a gasoline tank.
@vladdybear: Israel is supposed to be lovely. I think, if you want to visit, take this simple test: is your skin brown, like someone from the middle east? If so, you may want to skip it. Israel survives via racial profiling which is both non-PC and very effective.
@FightingChance: Not entirely true - they also profile based on religion (and if you claim to belong to one, you better be able to explain the tenets of it), past travel, age, gender and past associations. Ethnicity alone would be ineffective - see the link in my comment below on the Irish bomb-dupe.
I will not travel to Israel, because I would be too tempted to tell them that both they and everyone around them who has problems with them are all dumb, and someday after you're all dead, God is going to call you all into his office and ask why all his children, who are also brothers, can't get along, and nobody's going to have a good answer, and God will make everyone watch 10,000 years worth of video footage of kids with missing limbs or dead parents or just general shell shock.
@Canoehead: Are gays allowed? That seems like it also might be a hot button. Oh man, just hope you aren't a brown gay of the wrong religion vacationing...
@Span_Wolf: Israel is the only country in the region with a gay pride parade. Also, Israel will sometimes grant asylum to gay Palestinians who are outed, as it is essentially a death sentence in the WB or Gaza - in fact, this is one of the very, very few circumstances in which Israel will grant asylum to Palestinians. That said, there are certainly some untra-orthodox types who have religious/social policy issues with gays, but the state apparatus and the population in general is pretty tolerant.
@Canoehead: Re: Profiling. I went to Saudi Arabia somewhere around 1975-ish on business. To even get a Saudi entry visa, I had to get a notarized letter from my pastor stating I was not Jewish.
that probably wasn't shot, as the holes are different sizes and have burn marks and explosive residue around them. i think it was a couple shaped charges.
@CoyoteBrown: Yes and no. Shaped charges use a shaped explosive to superheat metal and launch that superheated metal in a predictable direction. Water disruptors utilize a shaped charge to blast a slug of water into the suspected explosive device.
HA!! These imbeciles can't figure out that the only important info in the laptop is the hardrive? Simply confescate it. What in the world was the point of shooting the laptop? Isn't this 2009? Attention Tel Aviv- Get a clue.
@CommentingpointlesslyisMeh: They were worried that it might be a bomb, not about any data that might be on the harddrive. The point was to sympathetically detonate it in a safe area. It was obviously an overreaction, but considering how often ACTUAL bombs blow up in Israel, I'm not entirely sure it wasn't justified. Hopefully they'll compensate the owner.
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-What real evidence did they have to think the laptop was a bomb?
-Why didn't they x-ray it?
-What's wrong with simply disassembling it with a robot or something? Less of a risk of "taking people's shit for no reason and shooting it."
-Has she filed an official complaint to the government? If I were here, I'd make a huge fucking deal of it.
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;)
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"Ya, that's a bomb... put a couple bullets in it, it'll be safe after that..."
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Brief explanation on disrupters from NOVA: "the slug of water which it projects bursts in all directions, and it tends to burst the bomb open from the inside. The idea, remember, is not to set the bomb off. It's to knock it apart, so you can gather up the components, but not to cause the bomb itself to explode. And out comes the pin."
12/15/09
Not for killing people like video games have suggested.
12/15/09
@BlackYoshi: It's also used for vehicle interdiction. In the case of long range ordnance disposal, they use an explosive round.
12/15/09
Keep your stuff as close as possible.
12/15/09
She was instructed to do so. Either one person told her to leave it there while she was being questioned, and someone else reported it as being suspicious, or they told her to leave it there specifically so they could collect and shoot her laptop.
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There has to be a part of the story she's keeping to her self, knowing the Israeli Government isn't going to explain it's side of the story to anyone, and if they do, it most likely won't make the news over here in the states.
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Didn't they do that to Bill as a prank in Newsradio?
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What actually causes the explosion when a bullet pierces a propane tank is not the heat of the bullet, but any sparks created by hitting the metal canister. It is well documented that gas cans have been shot leaving nothing more than two holes in the can itself.
If it had explosives in it, the bullets were very unlikely to set it off. Still, I don't see the reasoning behind shooting the thing either.
12/15/09
Exactly. In fact, a full metal gas tank should be more likely to just leak after being shot, as liquid gasoline is not explosively flammable (it's the gasoline vapors that combust).
12/15/09
12/16/09
Ah, yes. Well, there are actually differences in the way they'd behave. A gasoline tank won't blow up on its own. A propane or butane tank could, if the physical structure is breached in the right way, explode even if it doesn't combust. That explosion could cause bits of the tank to spark against each other, which would then lead to post-explosion combustion. This would never happen with a gasoline tank.
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I'd offer you the name of a country that noone really cares about, but I don't really care about them enough to know their names.
Ooh, ooh, wait! I know! Andora can be Linux. You know, that little three-city nation that sits on the border between Spain and France.
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I will not travel to Israel, because I would be too tempted to tell them that both they and everyone around them who has problems with them are all dumb, and someday after you're all dead, God is going to call you all into his office and ask why all his children, who are also brothers, can't get along, and nobody's going to have a good answer, and God will make everyone watch 10,000 years worth of video footage of kids with missing limbs or dead parents or just general shell shock.
And that is what I have to say about that.
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Interesting.@MiltoxBeyond: Yeh...that's true.
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EDIT: Everyone had that question.