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Chris Jacob
I do a lot of legal observing during protests. You know, taking pictures of the police and making notes to see if there is are any illegal arrests or potential excessive use of force cases.
This would be somewhat ethical if the IDF were trying to document the entire effect of their policy and blow-hard militarism (ie the trauma units and rescue workers, family members and fragile social systems trying to make life in Gaza more bearable). Where are the videos of those on the ground? It's easy to glorify violence from a birds-eye-view but it becomes nonsensical when it amounts to tearing apart innocent lives almost arbitrarily. I am amazed that collective punishment can still pass for 'foreign policy'.
I just don't get it. Why did Israel allow all those Arabs to migrate there in the first place? Did they let them come in as refugees or something? Let them run for government and what not.
I mean if we were to let half of mexico in, I'm sure we would have plenty of Mexican governors and who knows maybe a mexican president or two.
Sure youtube has "every right" to censor the videos, but they shouldn't be running a public website that allows user content, and then censor one group and not the other. 30 secs of searching youtubes site and you can easily find the SAME type of footage only with american's behind the guns, and there is no censoring going on there.
If your going to play internet neutral for the entire planet, don't play the double standard trick just because the uploaders arn't from your country.
Someone needs to say it, this is a rouge state bragging about it's latest campaign of genocide, there's just no other way to say it. They are broadcasting murder.
They are targeting and killing innocent civilians in an attempt to turn them against Hamas (which of course is stupid, since it just makes the population more hopeless and desperate, and embrace even more radical elements).
This idiotic argument that Israel can do whatever it wants under the guise of 'defense' is just criminal, it is literally no different than the actions of Bush in Iraq, this is right wing extremists perpetuating violence for the purpose of political capital, and monetary gain, period. The Likud Party are just the middle east branch of the neocons.
I just hope people understand that this against international law, as is Israels occupation, and that there is no equivalence between launching a few 'rockets' that don't kill anyone, and bombing a country into nothing, and killing thousands. One look at the death tolls on both sides shows that Israel is no victim, they are by far the most violent, and the most destabilizing in the region.
I also hope people understand that not everyone in Israel is for this slaughter, and even though it goes under-reported, the debate and the protests against the Israeli government are the most heated within Israel.
@Zombie_Belvedere: on the contrary, it is the terrorist organization Hamas who are the real villains here. You must remember who started the fighting first, Hamas did with their rockets and their calls for Israel to be obliterated. I feel that Israel has a definite right to defend their own country and people. I also dont think that any other state in the world would tolerate hundreds of missiles being rained down on their cities as long as Israel did without retaliating.
Hamas has repeatedly said that they want to push the Jews (the Yahoud means Jews not Israelis) "into the sea" and "destroy every one of them." When they fire rockets with the intent of causing civillian casualties, do you think THAT's ok? I'm not saying that Israel is always 100% in the right (i'm actually anti-Zionist) but BOTH SIDES need to accept responsibility and stop killing.
You really need to get your facts right before you comment....if Israel was "targeting and killing" civilians, don't you think that there would be more than 65 civilian deaths in a 4 day relentless air campaign that has struck 400+ targets (they have killed over 350 armed militants/terrorists though)? There are two possible explanations for this...1: Israel is deliberately trying to NOT kill civilians, which they have stated time and time again, or 2: Israeli pilots suck......I'm going with the first option. And in case you're wondering who your heroes, the Hamas, truly are, look here [us.cnn.com]
They are no better or different than Al Qaida, and I really hope they aren't your heroes too.
and i really must add, "rockets that don't kill people:" these rockets, while they are terribly inaccurate and quite crude, most certainly kill people. Even those who are not actually dead (although there are plenty, just yesterday two people, one a mother of four and the other a construction worker, were killed), their lives are ruined each day by these rockets fall on their cities..imagine, living in, lets say, San Diego, and living for eight years with the fear that tomorrow could be your last day, never being able to go outside because it's too far away from a bomb shelter. Thats no way to live. and Israel has repeatedly warned Hamas to stop or face the consequences.
And amazingly, truly unbelievably, Israel is taking the few civilian casualties it does inflict and treating them in Israeli hospitals. Their fight is not with the Palestinian people, and I really hope that everyone can realize that
And my final request, would Gizmodo please ban this person for senseless hate and flame, and make sure that everyone has their facts straight before commenting? Thank you
@hebrewhammer770: I think your response is very fair, but I don't think anyone is giving a free pass to Hama or the Palestinians. Obviously they are not free of blame, but there is a very real trend of siding with Israel in any dispute and you're called anti-semitic for being critical of Israel's actions. The criticism leveled towards the Palestinians is undeniably disproportionate and makes honest discussions nearly impossible.
Theres a difference in perspective, and theres just plain old wrong facts. His facts are incorrect, as he states that Israel is deliberately targeting civilians, when they are clearly not. That is not an opinion, it is fact. SO when someone comes on and says that, it is usually for the purpose of flaming Israel and making it seem like an educated opinion. Read between the lines good sir... and the trend is usually to side with the "poor oppressed Palestinians." Most of the media is very left wing. Israel these days recieves very little good PR, mostly becuase of the fact that Israelis just suck at PR. Just watch how much time on any news broadcast now devotes to the Palestinan side of the fence, showing horribly wounded casualties and failing to explain that they are terrorists, vs how much time they spend talking about how a couple of rockets are falling on Israel, failing to explain exactly how terrifying it is to have rockets falling on your head every day and most certainly not showing pictures of the many many casualties.
@Av Klein: Fact is there aren't that many casualties on israel's side, if I recall right, there was but one dead isreali from a palestinian rocket during the time of the current bombing. While there were something like 60 dead palestinians. And probably many of those were unnecessary, since the israelis have proved quite often that they are capable of high precision operations (do your recall sheikh yasin?), that's where the problem really lies.
@William_III_Earl_of_Dastardshi...: U bad example they blew up many civilians then, too. But they definitely have the equipment to avoid killing of innocents.
@William_III_Earl_of_Dastardshi...: No one has that kind of equipment when the terrorists are hiding among innocents. If there was a baddie-seeking bullet, Israel would use it. Besides, there's a big difference between collateral damage (which should of course be minimized as much as possible) and the deliberate targeting of civilians.
@Voyou_Charmant: I didn't call anyone anti-Semitic or anti-Jewish, and I don't think anyone else on this thread has either. It's just as wrong to resort to calling people anti-Semites as it is to preemptively accuse others of playing the race/religion card.
I don't side with Israel in every dispute. In fact, as a complete anti-Zionist I disagree with the majority of Israel's policies, both militarily and internally.
In response to your main point: I didn't say that Hamas is getting a free pass. The people in this thread who seem to agree with you typically say that a terrorist like Hamas is "not free of blame." To say that "Hama" (that's Hamas, by the way. I ordinarily wouldn't mention it, but to quote you: "Before you weigh in on something so complex, you should probably tackle the English language." Inability to spell the name of the organization that is in discussion weakens your point and makes you sound uneducated) is "not free of blame" is like saying any other terrorist or murderer is "not free of blame." You're technically correct, but you are downplaying the extreme evil of this group. Their charter calls for the destruction of Israel! And they are fully intent on following that charter!
Last: Please distinguish between criticism of "Palestinians" and criticism of terrorist groups.
It's not about "PR"; it's about intellectual honesty and to, for even a second, pretend that Israel is the poor victim is, well, intellectually dishonest. I'm not saying that Israel has not been a victim, but there is a very real problem with the way the Israeli government has handled the Palestinians, they are treated as second class citizens, they live in ghettos.
Unlike yourself, I don't believe either side is without blame, the position I'm taking is that of someone who wants to show the other side; not take sides. There is no question that the Palestinians and most certainly Hamas are doing very little to bring a peaceful resolution to the situation, but the same can be said of the Israelis, and that is undeniable.
Here are some, often overlooked facts:
Since September 29, 2000: 123 Israeli children killed by Palestinians compared to 1,050 Palestinian children killed.
1 Israeli is being held prisoner by Palestinians, while 10,756 Palestinians are currently imprisoned by Israel.
0 Israeli homes have been demolished by Palestinians and 18,147 Palestinian homes have been demolished by Israel since 1967.
This is all verifiable statistical data available from human rights organizations around the world.
At the end of the day both parties, like it or not, are responsible for unnecessary violence against the other.
@William_III_Earl_of_Dastardshi...: If they don't already, I'm sure the unwavering support of all but about 3 US politicians can make sure those weapons land in the right hands.
@hebrewhammer770: "Hama" was clearly a typo. Unlike the comment I made about someone who said "what are you insane . do you here your self"
1) A question ending in a period.
2) The word is "hear" not "here".
3) Yourself is one word.
4) Another question ended with the wrong punctuation.
That goes well beyond the missed S in a statement that is far from "OMG UR GAY!??!?!?!!!!!1111" that seems to qualify is political discourse.
Moving on the meat and potatoes of your post:
The "anti-semitic" bit is referencing the average pundit who decided to call people like Jimmy Carter anti-semitic after the release of Palestine: Peace Not Apartheid, not a commenter's statement. It's the default response from people who see someone as being even the least bit critical of Israel and it's totally out of line.
And where you may argue that I am downplaying the "extreme evil" of this group, you play up the "extreme evil".
Calling people "evil" or "terrorists" doesn't help your cause because it puts people in the catagory of "wrong" and "right", "good" and "bad" and that's childishly simplistic.
You have to approach the situation as truly unbiased and to be honest, I believe I am -- I have no vested interest in the success of any party/state/government/religion directly associated with this conflict, but I do believe in fairness and only point that I have tried to make throughout is that the criticism of the Israeli actions is not the same as the criticism of the actions of the Palestinians.
That goes well beyond the missed S in a much larger statement that is far from someone's "OMG UR GAY!??!?!?!!!!!1111" which seems to qualify as political discourse.
@hebrewhammer770: So, because they are hiding among innocent people, it's ok to kill those innocent people?
If a group of people in your neighborhood were to shoot-up a house, killing a couple of people and then take refuge in your house, while you are home, you would find no problem with the Police shooting up, burning down, or throwing some incendiary devices into your house and killing family members?
No. You wouldn't be ok with that, you and the surrounding community would be outraged because it is not an appropriate way to handle the situation.
The middle east has been fighting for thousands of years using tactics that the entire world can agree is barbaric. I find it hard to side with any country over there given these facts.
@Qasim Saeed: I like when people can make distinctions between killing with guns and killing with bombs, or killing with rocks and killing with a knife.
Maybe I'm just a little naive here, but, how do you qualify barbarism? I would think, at the end of the day, you've taken a life and, well, that is all there is to it.
The really disgusting thing here is why the lives are being taken. That's what people should be truly outraged over.
The vidoes themselves arent the problem. Its the fact that the Israel Army is posting them. So removing them was actually a good move on googles part. Who knows what kinds of edits the army put in the videos...
I understand the IDF's actions. They regularly videotape quite a bit of their operations, only if to provide some objective refutation to the highly exaggerated accounts and outright lies that are generally mouthed in the media.
@burgundyyears: So the IDF filming their actions is objective, the mainstream media is not? You're telling me someone like Wolf Blitzer, a member of AIPAC and CNN anchor, is going to provide an objective analysis?
The distortions and misrepresentations go both ways, Sir.
And I, for one, have not found sympathy for the Palestinians by watching the news.
I say upload it for everyone to see. Maybe people will pull their heads out of their asses and have their attention drawn away from the countless mind numbing retarded videos on youtube just long enough to see and actually start caring about the horrors that go on in the world.
@Jason Martin: djfoxx64 didn't support one side or the other, just asserted (in essence) that youtube, even when used as a tool for propaganda, is just another news source that lets people decide what to make of it. If you want to bring your political views into this, well... don't.
04/24/09
My dad likes to use them to take pictures at work. He's a mailman.
04/24/09
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04/24/09
04/24/09
04/24/09
This camera will be perfect for that.
04/24/09
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04/24/09
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04/24/09
What is OMG! Ponies!? Is that like disemvoweling on other gawker sites?
04/24/09
04/24/09
12/30/08
12/31/08
12/30/08
I mean if we were to let half of mexico in, I'm sure we would have plenty of Mexican governors and who knows maybe a mexican president or two.
12/31/08
12/30/08
If your going to play internet neutral for the entire planet, don't play the double standard trick just because the uploaders arn't from your country.
12/30/08
The name escapes me at the moment but I think it rhymes with 'YouTube'....
12/30/08
They are targeting and killing innocent civilians in an attempt to turn them against Hamas (which of course is stupid, since it just makes the population more hopeless and desperate, and embrace even more radical elements).
This idiotic argument that Israel can do whatever it wants under the guise of 'defense' is just criminal, it is literally no different than the actions of Bush in Iraq, this is right wing extremists perpetuating violence for the purpose of political capital, and monetary gain, period. The Likud Party are just the middle east branch of the neocons.
I just hope people understand that this against international law, as is Israels occupation, and that there is no equivalence between launching a few 'rockets' that don't kill anyone, and bombing a country into nothing, and killing thousands. One look at the death tolls on both sides shows that Israel is no victim, they are by far the most violent, and the most destabilizing in the region.
I also hope people understand that not everyone in Israel is for this slaughter, and even though it goes under-reported, the debate and the protests against the Israeli government are the most heated within Israel.
End rant.
12/30/08
12/30/08
Actions speak much much louder than words.....
12/30/08
Hamas has repeatedly said that they want to push the Jews (the Yahoud means Jews not Israelis) "into the sea" and "destroy every one of them." When they fire rockets with the intent of causing civillian casualties, do you think THAT's ok? I'm not saying that Israel is always 100% in the right (i'm actually anti-Zionist) but BOTH SIDES need to accept responsibility and stop killing.
12/31/08
You really need to get your facts right before you comment....if Israel was "targeting and killing" civilians, don't you think that there would be more than 65 civilian deaths in a 4 day relentless air campaign that has struck 400+ targets (they have killed over 350 armed militants/terrorists though)? There are two possible explanations for this...1: Israel is deliberately trying to NOT kill civilians, which they have stated time and time again, or 2: Israeli pilots suck......I'm going with the first option. And in case you're wondering who your heroes, the Hamas, truly are, look here [us.cnn.com]
They are no better or different than Al Qaida, and I really hope they aren't your heroes too.
and i really must add, "rockets that don't kill people:" these rockets, while they are terribly inaccurate and quite crude, most certainly kill people. Even those who are not actually dead (although there are plenty, just yesterday two people, one a mother of four and the other a construction worker, were killed), their lives are ruined each day by these rockets fall on their cities..imagine, living in, lets say, San Diego, and living for eight years with the fear that tomorrow could be your last day, never being able to go outside because it's too far away from a bomb shelter. Thats no way to live. and Israel has repeatedly warned Hamas to stop or face the consequences.
And amazingly, truly unbelievably, Israel is taking the few civilian casualties it does inflict and treating them in Israeli hospitals. Their fight is not with the Palestinian people, and I really hope that everyone can realize that
[www.foxnews.com]
And my final request, would Gizmodo please ban this person for senseless hate and flame, and make sure that everyone has their facts straight before commenting? Thank you
12/31/08
"launching a few 'rockets' that don't kill anyone"
what are you insane . do you here your self !!!.
i would like to see your city and house and friends & family take some of this few rockets and then i want to see what you would say then.
12/31/08
12/31/08
12/31/08
There was no "senseless hate" in anything he said. It's no different than your one sided and unbalanced representation of what is going on.
12/31/08
Before you weigh in on something so complex, you should probably tackle the English language.
12/31/08
Theres a difference in perspective, and theres just plain old wrong facts. His facts are incorrect, as he states that Israel is deliberately targeting civilians, when they are clearly not. That is not an opinion, it is fact. SO when someone comes on and says that, it is usually for the purpose of flaming Israel and making it seem like an educated opinion. Read between the lines good sir...
and the trend is usually to side with the "poor oppressed Palestinians." Most of the media is very left wing. Israel these days recieves very little good PR, mostly becuase of the fact that Israelis just suck at PR. Just watch how much time on any news broadcast now devotes to the Palestinan side of the fence, showing horribly wounded casualties and failing to explain that they are terrorists, vs how much time they spend talking about how a couple of rockets are falling on Israel, failing to explain exactly how terrifying it is to have rockets falling on your head every day and most certainly not showing pictures of the many many casualties.
12/31/08
12/31/08
12/31/08
12/31/08
I don't side with Israel in every dispute. In fact, as a complete anti-Zionist I disagree with the majority of Israel's policies, both militarily and internally.
In response to your main point: I didn't say that Hamas is getting a free pass. The people in this thread who seem to agree with you typically say that a terrorist like Hamas is "not free of blame." To say that "Hama" (that's Hamas, by the way. I ordinarily wouldn't mention it, but to quote you: "Before you weigh in on something so complex, you should probably tackle the English language." Inability to spell the name of the organization that is in discussion weakens your point and makes you sound uneducated) is "not free of blame" is like saying any other terrorist or murderer is "not free of blame." You're technically correct, but you are downplaying the extreme evil of this group. Their charter calls for the destruction of Israel! And they are fully intent on following that charter!
Last: Please distinguish between criticism of "Palestinians" and criticism of terrorist groups.
12/31/08
check out this post: [gizmodo.com]
It's not about "PR"; it's about intellectual honesty and to, for even a second, pretend that Israel is the poor victim is, well, intellectually dishonest. I'm not saying that Israel has not been a victim, but there is a very real problem with the way the Israeli government has handled the Palestinians, they are treated as second class citizens, they live in ghettos.
Unlike yourself, I don't believe either side is without blame, the position I'm taking is that of someone who wants to show the other side; not take sides. There is no question that the Palestinians and most certainly Hamas are doing very little to bring a peaceful resolution to the situation, but the same can be said of the Israelis, and that is undeniable.
Here are some, often overlooked facts:
Since September 29, 2000: 123 Israeli children killed by Palestinians compared to 1,050 Palestinian children killed.
1 Israeli is being held prisoner by Palestinians, while 10,756 Palestinians are currently imprisoned by Israel.
0 Israeli homes have been demolished by Palestinians and 18,147 Palestinian homes have been demolished by Israel since 1967.
This is all verifiable statistical data available from human rights organizations around the world.
At the end of the day both parties, like it or not, are responsible for unnecessary violence against the other.
Read all about it.
[en.wikipedia.org]
12/31/08
12/31/08
1) A question ending in a period.
2) The word is "hear" not "here".
3) Yourself is one word.
4) Another question ended with the wrong punctuation.
That goes well beyond the missed S in a statement that is far from "OMG UR GAY!??!?!?!!!!!1111" that seems to qualify is political discourse.
Moving on the meat and potatoes of your post:
The "anti-semitic" bit is referencing the average pundit who decided to call people like Jimmy Carter anti-semitic after the release of Palestine: Peace Not Apartheid, not a commenter's statement. It's the default response from people who see someone as being even the least bit critical of Israel and it's totally out of line.
And where you may argue that I am downplaying the "extreme evil" of this group, you play up the "extreme evil".
Calling people "evil" or "terrorists" doesn't help your cause because it puts people in the catagory of "wrong" and "right", "good" and "bad" and that's childishly simplistic.
You have to approach the situation as truly unbiased and to be honest, I believe I am -- I have no vested interest in the success of any party/state/government/religion directly associated with this conflict, but I do believe in fairness and only point that I have tried to make throughout is that the criticism of the Israeli actions is not the same as the criticism of the actions of the Palestinians.
12/31/08
That goes well beyond the missed S in a much larger statement that is far from someone's "OMG UR GAY!??!?!?!!!!!1111" which seems to qualify as political discourse.
12/31/08
If a group of people in your neighborhood were to shoot-up a house, killing a couple of people and then take refuge in your house, while you are home, you would find no problem with the Police shooting up, burning down, or throwing some incendiary devices into your house and killing family members?
No. You wouldn't be ok with that, you and the surrounding community would be outraged because it is not an appropriate way to handle the situation.
12/30/08
12/31/08
12/31/08
Maybe I'm just a little naive here, but, how do you qualify barbarism? I would think, at the end of the day, you've taken a life and, well, that is all there is to it.
The really disgusting thing here is why the lives are being taken. That's what people should be truly outraged over.
12/30/08
12/30/08
umm.. have you seen the videos of muslims ripping the heart out of the isreali soldiers put there by some terrorist?
12/31/08
12/30/08
12/31/08
The distortions and misrepresentations go both ways, Sir.
And I, for one, have not found sympathy for the Palestinians by watching the news.
12/30/08
12/30/08
12/30/08