Senior Contributing Editors:
Jesus Diaz
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Mark Wilson, Reviews
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Contributing Editors:
Matt Buchanan | AIM | Twitter
Adam Frucci | Twitter
Sean Fallon | Twitter
Jack Loftus | Twitter
John Herrman | Twitter
Dan Nosowitz
Chris Mascari
Kat Hannaford | Twitter
Rosa Golijan | Twitter
Chris Jacob
At the risk of getting on an off-topic rant, I think the digital copy of paperbacks is the only place digital copies make sense.
The only reason I'm (technically) not allowed to make my own damn digital copy of a movie is because of a paradox in the law. The movie's already digital.
But yes, of all the Blackberries I've had the displeasure of using, I can agree....I don't think a single one of them would be good for reading for any period of time comfortably.
Only slightly off-topic-So I sat down and watched a couple of episodes of Star Trek: TNG last night. During one episode, there was a scene where Picard is reading a book on one of those super-futuristic Star Trek tablets, and it hit me. We're there. Within a few years, "everyone" will have one of these impossible, Star Trek devices. They're going to be thin, cheap, and ubiquitous. We'll call on them. We'll watch movies on them, read on them, and check warp-core status on them. They're already here.
Therein lies the reason that e-readers' days are numbered. We, as a culture, are moving past the point where people are going to accept a one-use device. I can read most books on my Kindle, but I can't do anything else, at least not well. I don't have the time, space, or patience to deal with carting multiple devices around. I know that sounds whiney and unrealistic, but it's really not. Look down at your iPhone; it's just the tiniest taste of where we're headed. I think Amazon sees this, and that's why we're going to see more Kindle software than Kindles.
@Segador: I agree to a point, but form factor needs to be considered.
The convenience of reading on a phone is always welcome, but it's a ridiculously annoying format both in size and format. Nobody would choose to read that way over a full-size page, except in a pinch.
The convergence of devices has to have a limit, and that limit will be defined by usability. Nobody wants an e-reader to be as small as a phone, and nobody wants a phone to be as big as an e-reader.
That said, I think flexibility is key. Amazon is smart to get its books on as many devices as possible, and to let the user decide the best way to read them. That's where I think the future lies -- technology with sufficient cross-compatibility that everybody gets to decide how to make it work best for them.
@Segador: Yeah, but the whole benefit of an ereader is the screen. It's incredible. Not to mention the fact that both the nook and the kindle are slim and lightweight; definitely not a burden to tote around.
@Robotronic: I own a Kindle, and I agree, e-ink is amazing, and a great reading medium. That said, until it can refresh at a rate fast enough to display color video and web, the devices will be crippled.
@Segador: What you're promoting is The Myth of Convergence; that somehow every thing we need computers for will somehow be rolled into just one device. The reason it's a myth is that while some devices do take on the features of others, no multifunction device can ever do any feature as well as a same-generation dedicated device, and no one device can ever serve all purposes. Next generation tablet computers may well be as good for reading books as this generation's ebook reader, but next generation's ebook readers will be much better than that. Take the iPhone as an example - did it kill the MP3 player? No. Devices with more storage, more music-centric features, or at a lower price are still competitive music playing devices. Is there a limit? Yes, probably. In a generation or two of the iPhone, it will be able to hold 120GBs of music and stream HD & sat radio and Pandora or whatever, and you probably won't need an MP3 player. But by then what we think of as an MP3 (or PMP) player now will have morphed into something else that is even better at what it does than the iPhone of the future. Another argument agasinst the MoC is that no one size or configuration of device can possibly serve all your needs. You don't want to make phone calls on something as large as a book, you can't comfortably do a lot of work on something with a 6-inch screen, and you probably don't want to lug around laptop with a keyboard and 15" screen just so that you can read the news.
So the point is that devices will always change and grow, and that no device will ever cover all functionality that we need. And dedicated devices will always be better at what they do than anything that tries to be everything. The other point, which seems to be missed in all this ranting about ebook readers, is that like it or not books are going digital and yes, there are going to be a lot of devices that are going to be able to read those books. So like it or not, ebook readers are here to stay, whether they look like the Kindle or the PADD of Star Trek in the future we don't know, but one thing is sure; there are going to be a lot fewer paper books.
@OMG! weatherman: I agree, to an extent; no one device will meet all the world's needs for everything. For example, I still need a real keyboard to get any real work done. No amount of touchscreen goodness will change that, at least in the forseeable future.
However, the Convergence Myth really isn't a myth. Let's go back to an easy example, the iPhone. If people had told me 10 years ago that you could read, call, surf the web, shop, listen to music, watch movies, game, manage finances, run much of a business, text, email, and shoot quality video+photos from one device, there's no way I would have believed them. It's a convergence of at least eight devices that, 10-15 years ago, only existed as standalone objects, and it's just the beginning.
Will one future device meet every need for every human at all times? No. It's a logical impossibility. We will, however, continue to cram more and more functionality into single devices.
@OMG! weatherman: Your arguments are well-reasoned and you make some great points. I can see how some dedicated devices are probably always going to be better at what they do than an all-in one. I doubt many people threw their cameras away when they got an iPhone.
@Segador: Yep. I think reading, however, is one that will be just as good on a converged device with enough improvement in screen and battery technology. The functionality involved in reading is pretty basic. You do the same sort of things that you do with other documents on your computer: read, search, annotate, edit, follow links to other content, etc. There is nothing about the software end of things that current tablets don't do better than readers. The only thing they fail in is the hardware but we are not that far away from the point where it will catch up.
The camera analogy is similar in that you're still dealing with hardware limitations. Putting the optics and sensor you would need to get a really good picture on a phone makes the phone too big. However, compact point and shoot cameras are losing ground to phones. DSLRs and the more advanced point and shoots are not. It's hard to see convergence there because the hardware is so far away from being at any level where you could get good imaging on a tiny sensor and lens. Who knows if we will ever be able to do so.
So last week it was "I have no beef with reading ebooks on a mobile phone" and this week it's "stupid"? And you want publishers to give away digital editions with physical copies, but you disapprove of people reading those digital copies on a Kindle or Nook or a phone? I'm just not sure what you're arguing any more.
I think people should be able to read on whatever device they find convenient and comfortable. I've read books on my PDAs and phones since the age of the Palm III, and I'm not alone. So it seems like a pretty smart move for Amazon to put their reader on as many platforms as possible. And I'm sure that Kindle owners who also have Blackberries will appreciate the WhisperSync - I know I do.
@OMG! weatherman: I think reading ebooks on a BlackBerry is a stupid idea - unless it's a Storm, the screensize is too small to make it a positive experience.
Reading on a larger touchscreen, such as an iPhone, Android or the HD2 is fine, that I have no problem with.
Digital copies given away with paperbacks is the way forward, as long as users are able to load it onto any device - not necessarily an ereader, it can be on a netbook, laptop or phone too. It's the idea of ereaders which I find redundant, not necessarily ebooks. I recognise that people are buying ereaders (someone must be inflating Amazon's wealth) and are quite happy with them, but I just don't see these stand-alone devices actually sticking around for long.
@Kat Hannaford: not to belabor a point, but again your arguments seem to be shifting. Last week you said; "Consumers won't buy an electronic book when they can get a paperback for the same price or even less, and when they can lend it to friends, read it in the bathtub or even sell it on and make a percentage of their money back....Our grandchildren won't be housing first edition ebook copies of War and Peace in an antiquated Kindle, passed down from generation to generation. There's no opportunity to get sentimental over an e-book..."
You also seem to want to continue to insult anyone who does anything differently than the way that you do it, calling them stupid and suggesting that the should be mugged and laughed at. I don't see it that way. Someone people might think it's silly to read a book on a computer, others think it's silly to read it on an iPhone, still others (like yourself) apparently draw the line when the screen size drops down to 3" or some other arbitrary measure. I say whatever people want to read their books on, that's fine by me. Because you see it's not the device that matters, it's the reading. Which is why when you say that ebook readers aren't going to be around very long I think you've got it exactly backwards; it's the paper book that is the transitional technology.
PS The offer still stands - I will loan you my Kindle for a week and I'll even buy you a book of your choosing as an x-mas present if you want to experience what it's like to actually life with one of these devices for awhile. I think it might change your mind.
@weatherman: This is the last time I'm going to reply on this thread, as I've got posts to write, but let me run through it quickly:
I'm not calling people who read ebooks stupid, I said that the Kindle app for BlackBerry is stupid. I've already outlined why I think that. Of course, if you read an ereader in public, you're going to be a target for muggers - the same way if you use an iPod, mobile phone or laptop. Perhaps you live in a safer area than I do, the crime rate's pretty high here in London where I live. You seem to be very quick to take my word for truth - when actually you can't cut through the humour to get to the point I'm trying to make.
And thanks for the offer, but I've had a Kindle for a while now actually. I'm currently reading Twilight (heaven forbid) because when I searched for Bret Easton Ellis, Irvine Welsh, Haruki Murakami, Audrey Niffenegger and even JK friggin' Rowling I couldn't actually find any books from any of them.
Now, back to work. Thank you for your comments and eagle-eyed criticism.
@Kat Hannaford: Amazon has titles by all those authors except Rowling (who refuses to allow ebook versions of her work). Granted they are not complete collections but to say there are not "any" books by them simply isn't true.
Meh. I guess if you were waiting until reviews for the nook came in, now is the best time to buy a kindle before Xmas and any discount is netter than none. But if you're not geting one as a gift, wait; we'll see k3 in February.
I work at a Borders in NJ and we sell two of the three Sony eReaders at our store; one is a touchscreen, the other a regular version with buttons, at $199 and $299 respectively.
The old Sony eBook Store (before it became just Reader Store) used to say Borders in the top banner. I think they had it set up were Borders provided to the actually store part, and Sony the reader.
yea Borders has been pretty much dying for the last decade, it's amazing they haven't died yet. This will be their death throe. Their business decisions have always been poor, I doubt jumping on the bandwagon at the last minute will save them from years of poor management.
"most of Kobo's 2 million titles are free" - that's just bunk. The same math that Sony/Google and B&N/Nook use to suggest that they have lots of free stuff that Amazon doesn't when in fact it's all stuff that is out of copyright and just as accessible from on the Kindle as any other reader.
12/18/09
12/18/09
The only reason I'm (technically) not allowed to make my own damn digital copy of a movie is because of a paradox in the law. The movie's already digital.
But yes, of all the Blackberries I've had the displeasure of using, I can agree....I don't think a single one of them would be good for reading for any period of time comfortably.
12/18/09
Therein lies the reason that e-readers' days are numbered. We, as a culture, are moving past the point where people are going to accept a one-use device. I can read most books on my Kindle, but I can't do anything else, at least not well. I don't have the time, space, or patience to deal with carting multiple devices around. I know that sounds whiney and unrealistic, but it's really not. Look down at your iPhone; it's just the tiniest taste of where we're headed. I think Amazon sees this, and that's why we're going to see more Kindle software than Kindles.
12/18/09
The convenience of reading on a phone is always welcome, but it's a ridiculously annoying format both in size and format. Nobody would choose to read that way over a full-size page, except in a pinch.
The convergence of devices has to have a limit, and that limit will be defined by usability. Nobody wants an e-reader to be as small as a phone, and nobody wants a phone to be as big as an e-reader.
That said, I think flexibility is key. Amazon is smart to get its books on as many devices as possible, and to let the user decide the best way to read them. That's where I think the future lies -- technology with sufficient cross-compatibility that everybody gets to decide how to make it work best for them.
12/18/09
Excellent point. I figure we'll all just use our Starfleet badges to communicate, though.
12/18/09
12/18/09
12/18/09
So the point is that devices will always change and grow, and that no device will ever cover all functionality that we need. And dedicated devices will always be better at what they do than anything that tries to be everything. The other point, which seems to be missed in all this ranting about ebook readers, is that like it or not books are going digital and yes, there are going to be a lot of devices that are going to be able to read those books. So like it or not, ebook readers are here to stay, whether they look like the Kindle or the PADD of Star Trek in the future we don't know, but one thing is sure; there are going to be a lot fewer paper books.
12/18/09
However, the Convergence Myth really isn't a myth. Let's go back to an easy example, the iPhone. If people had told me 10 years ago that you could read, call, surf the web, shop, listen to music, watch movies, game, manage finances, run much of a business, text, email, and shoot quality video+photos from one device, there's no way I would have believed them. It's a convergence of at least eight devices that, 10-15 years ago, only existed as standalone objects, and it's just the beginning.
Will one future device meet every need for every human at all times? No. It's a logical impossibility. We will, however, continue to cram more and more functionality into single devices.
12/18/09
12/18/09
12/18/09
The camera analogy is similar in that you're still dealing with hardware limitations. Putting the optics and sensor you would need to get a really good picture on a phone makes the phone too big. However, compact point and shoot cameras are losing ground to phones. DSLRs and the more advanced point and shoots are not. It's hard to see convergence there because the hardware is so far away from being at any level where you could get good imaging on a tiny sensor and lens. Who knows if we will ever be able to do so.
12/18/09
I think people should be able to read on whatever device they find convenient and comfortable. I've read books on my PDAs and phones since the age of the Palm III, and I'm not alone. So it seems like a pretty smart move for Amazon to put their reader on as many platforms as possible. And I'm sure that Kindle owners who also have Blackberries will appreciate the WhisperSync - I know I do.
12/18/09
Reading on a larger touchscreen, such as an iPhone, Android or the HD2 is fine, that I have no problem with.
Digital copies given away with paperbacks is the way forward, as long as users are able to load it onto any device - not necessarily an ereader, it can be on a netbook, laptop or phone too. It's the idea of ereaders which I find redundant, not necessarily ebooks. I recognise that people are buying ereaders (someone must be inflating Amazon's wealth) and are quite happy with them, but I just don't see these stand-alone devices actually sticking around for long.
12/18/09
You also seem to want to continue to insult anyone who does anything differently than the way that you do it, calling them stupid and suggesting that the should be mugged and laughed at. I don't see it that way. Someone people might think it's silly to read a book on a computer, others think it's silly to read it on an iPhone, still others (like yourself) apparently draw the line when the screen size drops down to 3" or some other arbitrary measure. I say whatever people want to read their books on, that's fine by me. Because you see it's not the device that matters, it's the reading. Which is why when you say that ebook readers aren't going to be around very long I think you've got it exactly backwards; it's the paper book that is the transitional technology.
PS The offer still stands - I will loan you my Kindle for a week and I'll even buy you a book of your choosing as an x-mas present if you want to experience what it's like to actually life with one of these devices for awhile. I think it might change your mind.
12/18/09
I'm not calling people who read ebooks stupid, I said that the Kindle app for BlackBerry is stupid. I've already outlined why I think that. Of course, if you read an ereader in public, you're going to be a target for muggers - the same way if you use an iPod, mobile phone or laptop. Perhaps you live in a safer area than I do, the crime rate's pretty high here in London where I live. You seem to be very quick to take my word for truth - when actually you can't cut through the humour to get to the point I'm trying to make.
And thanks for the offer, but I've had a Kindle for a while now actually. I'm currently reading Twilight (heaven forbid) because when I searched for Bret Easton Ellis, Irvine Welsh, Haruki Murakami, Audrey Niffenegger and even JK friggin' Rowling I couldn't actually find any books from any of them.
Now, back to work. Thank you for your comments and eagle-eyed criticism.
12/18/09
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12/17/09
At least they are in the UK anyway. If the situation is similar in the US they probably don't have the resources to bring out competition.
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