motionblur - Gizmodo

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Why You Don't Need To Spend Extra Money On a 240 Hz LCD TV
Study Claims Motion Blur Is a Non-Issue In Most Mid-To-High-End LCDs
JVC Builds 180Hz LCD That Makes 120Hz LCDs Look Like Chumps

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fuchikoma
11/06/09

In reply to Study Claims Motion Blur Is a Non-Issue In Most Mid-To-High-End LCDs
Just as there are "super noses" who can detect the slightest variation in a million wines, or people who can tell you exactly which frequency they're hearing, there will be people who can see blur in most LCDs.

Personally I haven't seen LCD blur since around 12-15ms response times became the norm. I see MPEG artifacting and trailing, and even dim afterimages in HDMI signals on PS3 and 360, but motion is not an issue. #motionblur
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Meantux
11/05/09

In reply to Why You Don't Need To Spend Extra Money On a 240 Hz LCD TV
To illustrate this effect we either need something filmed by a hd-high-speed camera or at least some high res snapshots of the difformed result, not with some low-res 15fps that adds its own artefacts and clunkyness. #refreshrates
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HIcycles
11/05/09

@Meantux: Right? I couldn't tell the difference. #refreshrates
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d_r_e
11/05/09

@HIcycles: Same here. I couldn't tell the difference either. #refreshrates
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Cash907Censored
11/06/09

@Meantux:
I'm glad I'm not the only person who got absolutely nothing other then confusion out of that video. #refreshrates
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TheClap
11/05/09

In reply to Why You Don't Need To Spend Extra Money On a 240 Hz LCD TV
I um....cant tell the difference.... What is this soap opera effect? We have a Sony Bravia that has the 120Hz thing but I dont notice a soap opera effect. #refreshrates
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Geekfox
11/05/09

@TheClap: Taking a 24 frame per second film and recreating frames (usually doubling frame rates or more) to life-like motion is what some called "soap opera" effect, as some TV shows like soap operas can broadcast a life-like motion of 60 frames per second while other shows or films or animated cartoons broadcast at 24 or 30 frames per second.

Personally, I hate calling the effect "soap opera", as I don't watch soap operas -- but I think it's a critic's term to define life-like motions for motion interpolation features on HDTV sets. #refreshrates
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Norm the Alligator
11/05/09

In reply to Why You Don't Need To Spend Extra Money On a 240 Hz LCD TV
My set does 120 Hz, but I keep it off. I don't like watching high budget movies that result in looking like they're made for TV. My BluRay player gives me the option of 24p which is what I keep on instead. #refreshrates
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JayD16
11/05/09

@Keith Noordzy: Isn't that more nostalgia than picture quality? #refreshrates
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Daniel Wong
11/05/09

@JayD16: no its actually more accurate and has a better PQ. movies are made to be seen in 24hz #refreshrates
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ripfire
11/05/09

@Daniel Wong: Actually, while the film runs on 24hz, movie theater projectors flash the frames twice or three times the rate to reduce flicker. #refreshrates
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Cash907Censored
11/06/09

@Norm the Alligator:
Is this why bluray movies shown on new 240hz screens look like absolute surreal crap? The worst for this was animated movies like Wall*E, which reminded of those old school animations that came out of the first CGI college classes back in the early to mid 90's. You all know the ones I'm talking about. #refreshrates
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Cash907Censored
11/06/09

@ripfire:
Why would they do this? Flicker is a good thing, as it keeps the audience in a semi-trance, and glued to the movie screen. I just watched a program on Discovery HD that talked about how Sony had to spend millions getting their HD theater projectors to perform more like traditional film projectors, while keeping the higher resolution and cleaner image. #refreshrates
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aniteshj
11/05/09

In reply to Why You Don't Need To Spend Extra Money On a 240 Hz LCD TV
In the same way WHAT content is natively rendered at 120Hz, or 240Hz?

I like my plasma because it doesn't pull the "soap opera effect" on everything I watch, and please don't say you can turn it off. The feature should exist to complement and add to the experiance. Not soap opera everything.

Well everything I am saying is a moot point, I don't care what LCD has going for it.

I have a Kuro. :P #refreshrates
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MarcusMaximus
11/05/09

@aniteshj: I do believe that effect is caused by Digital Natural Motion, which is a form of software processing, not by the 120/240Hz refresh rates themselves. Those refresh rates(at least this is the effect for me) actually make the frame rates of both film(for blu-ray disks, 24Hz) and HDTV(60Hz) go in evenly, which removes the need for nasty effects such as 3:2 pulldown. #refreshrates
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ripfire
11/05/09

@MarcusMaximus: Read the article. #refreshrates
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cbstryker
11/05/09

@ripfire: MarcusMaximus is right. It's the software (or algorithms) that causes the issue. And the main benefit of a 240Hz TV is to be able to watch 3D content at 120Hz (per eye that is). For everything else 120Hz is just fine. Actually it's perfect. #refreshrates
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ripfire
11/06/09

@cbstryker: I'm not saying he's wrong. I'm just saying read the article because it explains everything. #refreshrates
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Mike
11/05/09

In reply to Why You Don't Need To Spend Extra Money On a 240 Hz LCD TV
Does this affect LCDs with LED backlighting? I'm thinking of buying the Samsung LED TV but the 240 Hz is so much more expensive than the 120 Hz.
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Nick promoted this comment Edited by Mike at 11/05/09 6:05 PM Mike was starred Mike was unstarred

Nick
11/05/09

@Mike: i don't think it is an issue that stems from the light source, but the processor. i believe it starts to incorporate frame interpolation with higher refresh rates and what not which ain't everyone's cup-o-noodle. #refreshrates
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mlvds
11/05/09

@Mike: Just buy a Panasonic Plasma anything about S1 series...you can't go wrong...

I have a 2006 600series and I been more then happy with it..

There will be huge deal after Black Friday! #refreshrates
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NeerajSV
11/05/09

@Nick: Its not the processor.. its the response time of the pixels to change state. Liquid crystals are, after all, physical entities that twist and bend to change the color of light passing though them. It take time to go from one state to anther. #refreshrates
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Nick
11/05/09

@NeerajSV: your comment disagrees with what the original article seems to be alluding to. #refreshrates
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Mike
11/05/09

@mlvds: The room has a huge glass sliding door facing the sun. Plasmas are better for darker rooms. #refreshrates
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John Duffin
11/05/09

@Nick: The issue with lcd is the response time as Nick says, generally around 6 - 8ms on LCD, however Plasma has much less time <1ms therefore less motionblur. The 120HZ and 240HZ interpolate extra frames to smooth out the picture. This can have a video effect on film based content, however i believe this to be far less so than the first chips that came out. The pro versions now input extra blank frames to further smooth the motion and give a more realistic effect. Response time is falling on LCD and however for now if you buy a good set with higher quality interpolation, the effect can be excellent especially on video content. #refreshrates
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Cash907Censored
11/06/09

@mlvds: Why would you do this, when you can buy a mirror that size for a hundred bucks, and get the same amount of enjoyment out of the fancy plasma you're talking up?

Plasma's might be great in a totally dark room, but they are fucking worthless in the average living room. #refreshrates
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MarcusMaximus
11/04/09

In reply to Study Claims Motion Blur Is a Non-Issue In Most Mid-To-High-End LCDs
Umm isn't the 60Hz important because it exactly matches broadcast HD framerate? And 120Hz is because both 60Hz(for the reason above) and 24Hz(because movies are filmed at 24Hz) both go evenly into it? I always thought the issue was more with dropped frames and the like due to mismatched frame rates. #motionblur
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N@tedog
11/04/09

@MarcusMaximus: Stop with the curveballs. This is any easy yes or no question. With that in mind, you can never tame the beast. Moving on... #motionblur
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MarcusMaximus
11/04/09

@N@tedog: How is that a curveball? The article says that 60 and 120Hz refresh rates aren't necessary to not have motion blur, and I responded saying It was my understanding they were mainly for a different, unrelated function, and one which they do actually perform. As far as I can tell that's perfectly on topic and a valid response. #motionblur
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