Running down the battery in my iPod doesn't affect my phone. This is a good thing.
If I were to use the music capabilities on my phone, I'd run those batteries out instead. This is bad.
Do we see the problem here? Until someone makes a phone that can get at least 12 hours of talk/music time with an average load from background apps at the same time, using a phone as a PMP isn't feasible. Similarly, the iPod Touch's ZOMG HUEG screen drains the battery faster than the small screen on my 5G iPod.
There's also tactile issues. I use my iPod in the car to pipe through the stereo. The iPod in general doesn't have the greatest tactile feedback, but the old school ones have something. You get nothing from a flat sheet of plastic.
Is it nice to have a music player in my phone? Absolutely! Is it, or will it ever be my primary player? Hell no.
Ok, you know what? I LIKE dumb PMPs. When I lost my 4g iPod, I bought a 5g iPod Classic. Why? Because all I want from my damn mp3 player is for it to play mp3s that are synced from my player of choice, iTunes. Yes, I know, I could get something cheaper and install some random ass workaround that allows it to download my songs from iTunes (or not use iTunes), but I just want to listen to music without a fuss, without any hassles, and without some cranky little portable OS crashing on me. Apple, not everything needs to be upgraded - sometimes simple is just as good!
@S-Express: Yeah, Windows-only for me was the real dealbreaker. I honestly was considering a Zune HD, and then found out I can't use it w/ my Mac. Oh well. $300 stays in my pocket.
yesterday i had some free time, so i searched for iPod touch top games, i was extremely surprised with all those new games available.
until the Zune get a decent App store like Apples, i dont know why people would prefer it over the touch.
Enjoy ur HD radio while i enjoy Assasins Creed on my iPod!!
Apple beating Microsoft in games field :), didnt expect to say that any day.
Since I'm lucky enough to have a employer supplied phone, the iphone or the like just doesn't interest me. But until the Touch, ZuneHD or equivalent get up to some real memory numbers (100+ gigs) I'm really not interested there either. Granted, Arhos products look inviting but I find lack of itunes or Zune marketplace content management and automation disheartening. In the meantime I've got my ipod classic, and I'm really having a hard time seeing anything wrong with it.
@PWarren4: I'm with you on this. The Zune HD looks amazing, but I'm hard pressed to give up my 120GBs on what is a damn fine Zune "classic". I've got 32GBs on my phone. I use my PMP to carry *everything* with me. Sure there's not apps, but I've got my entire music collection on the thing...
Having seen the shovelware in the Apple App Store, it just seems like Apple is aiming the iPhone more and more as a lite gaming machine than an actual business device.
The iDisk app was both grossly late and severely lacking in robust features; the device isn't secure; the push email is still not 100% complete (GMail push please); and there is still a lot of kludge to simple features (Contacts on the phone are separate from contacts on MobileMe).
On top of that, the one feature I'd love to see for iTunes is notable by its absence - subscription pricing. I downloaded about 12 albums both before and after a great Reverend Horton Heat/Motorhead concert using ZunePass. Total cost: $15 per month. On iTunes, it would have been more expensive than a year's subscription to ZunePass.
Apple's App Store is getting very game-heavy and there is not a lot of movement on the iTunes front either.
I still think that subscription is a killer app which may help Zune get some legs. Apple is missing a window.
@OMG! Ponies!: The last thing I need right now is another monthly fee. I've recently cut all monthly "luxury" fees. I've cut my internet service from 12mbps to 6mbps and no longer get HD service. It will save me roughly $500 this year.
Now I don't completely understand Zune pass but I think I get the basic understanding. Correct me if I'm wrong. But if for any time I would need to cancel my subscription I loose all downloaded music expect for 1 album I get to keep every month. So after a year I've spent $180 to keep 12 albums. And that's only albums, not singles or certain tracks I wanted from an artist. It just doesn't seem like a good deal to me. I'd rather buy $180 of music each year that I selected weather that be singles, a couple singles, or albums.
I guess it could work if you download an assload of music every month. But I, and I think the majority of people, don't. Some months I don't want to spend any money on music. I have a great collection already, and between the last two months I've spent tops $10 on music. And who knows what I'll be buying in the upcoming months. Maybe nothing for the next 6 months, maybe an assload, but that's the reason I won't be purchasing my music on a subscription basis.
@macpatrick: there is no restriction on chosing singles for the zune pass and while you're right you could go a month or two without downloading new albums and be satisfied but the zune pass legal removes the road blocks to exploring new artists and sounds
@OMG! Ponies!: Agreed, what iTouch needs most is the ability to use it as a standard USB harddrive. Even if it's within one isolated folder hidden somewhere deep in the file system
@OMG! Ponies!: not just the device... idisk too... every mobile me function is sent in the clear (except find my iphone related features)... while my free google account encrypts everything. it's like apple goes out of their way to put everyone's information out there in the clear.
I don't want a "smart" PMP. That's what my phone is for. Why do you need a smartphone, and then a smartphone without the phone? Who would carry around an iPhone and an iPod Touch? Smart PMPs are only useful for people with crappy cellphones.
I'll stick with my Cowon S9. I can make the UI look however I want, it sounds bloody fantastic (kicks the shit out of a zune and ipod in that area, thank you very much) and it has mega battery life. That's all I want. I have a web browser on my phone, and facebook on my phone.
@Jeb_Hoge: I was thinking the same.
I have a hacked Palm Lifedrive, but it's getting more damaged as time passes...
I have to find a replacement device, but Palm Pre is not available here in Canada yet, and won't be on my network.
Am I the ONLY person that uses their MP3 player in the car? The last thing I want is something without physical buttons so I have to look to change songs and watch the screen get scratched the hell up by my cup holder. Seriously, this touch screen stuff is cute and all but it's not for everyone. If the Zune HD takes off gaming wise I'm looking into it but my 80gb Zune does me just fine because all I need is music, not music and the kitchen sink.
@kernel panic: Agree. I find when I try iPod, Bluetooth, and Google Maps at the same time, stuff really lagged. I just bought a 5th gen Nano for the car and gym.
I need physical buttons, not a damn touch screen. I need it not to be my phone, as I actually use my phone a bit differently. Having music on my phone is nice for a backup, but it is more of a mixed media device, where my music player is dedicated to music only. At work, I can leave the music player tied to the stereo while I wander off with my phone somewhere. I don't need just one device, I need a really good and flexible music player. If that happens to be a Touch, so be it, but if I had my choice, it would be a Nano or Zune HD with a full-function physical remote, FM and HD radios and BT audio. Of course, I know I'm in the minority, but I love the size, weight and battery life of the smaller devices.
@Maori_Yelir: I really wish that somebody would make a touchscreen media player with physical Play/Pause and Skip buttons. I don't understand why nobody does it, it seems like such an obvious feature.
I think Apple has just brainwashed everybody beyond repair into hating buttons. If they're useful and straightforward, then it's worth having them.
These are just PDAs with big memory. Don't get me wrong, I am very happy with this new generation of PDAs, but that is what they are. The touch is everything I wanted from my Palm or WinMo device 10 years ago!
@mclark2112: Well said. I was just thinking the same thing.
The iPhone Touch is multipurpose device that evolved up from an MP3 player. But about a decade ago we had PDAs that were basically pocket computers that had simplified to fit the technologies of the time.
Back when the iPod was first released, I was already in love with my new iPaq PDA that allowed me to take my computer with me in a pocket computer form. With internet and apps, and even a video player.
The only difference is I wasn't restricted to using a proprietary media playerto put music and video on it, or buying "approved" apps that were allowed by HP.
@Kerensky97: Very true, the iPaq was a great device. It had great codec support; and with the right player, you could play just about any video or audio. So in my book it beats any of those new "shiny" devices in terms of features.
a little sansa clip is nice, though, because it's extremely simple (drag and drop!) extremely small, extremely inexpensive, extremely durable, and has extremely good battery life.
the ipod touch in the pocket frightens me, especially while im at work. there's glass in 'em. they're fragile. and they take up quite a bit of pocket real estate.
i tend to use the clip for podcasts and as a portable flash drive, and for when i'm in situations where the ipod touch wouldn't fare well (be it getting dropped, getting scratched, or getting dunked)
as a primary device, the clip is barely adequate. but that's ok - it's expendable. I haven't put a lot of time into downloading apps, or amassing a huge library of music onto it. i wont be out hundreds of dollars if i destroy it.
i think dedicated, 'dumb' PMPs will persist for quite a while, even if they have to take a back seat to more expensive capable devices. because, lets face it, the iTouch isn't a mp3 player that can run apps. it's an app platform that also plays mp3s.
@nutbastard: Expendable is the word. Negligent is my middle name and my devices show the tell tale signs of various drops and scratches. I like having my little cheapo Sansa MP3 player. Powered by a cheapo AAA battery, compatible with any USB enabled computing system. And if I lose it, no biggie.
In fact, I'm even afraid to upgrade to a new phone in the fears that I'll scratch it, so I use a cheapo one.
I'm probably part of the minority here, but I suppose I'll have to upgrade sometime. I really like the functionality in the new generation of phones and media players that all my friends have. But then again, I've seen what happens to their devices after a bit of misuse or unfortunate technical hiccups...
Since getting my smartphone, I ditched my PMP. Although it has less storage for music and video, it's much easier to have it consolidated on a device I always have with me anyway. Also, it's much, much easier to sync my media files to my phone than it ever was with my PMP. Also, I just doubled the storage capacity on my phone the other day, and can also carry another 16GB with me if I really needed to, and swap it out for an entire new catalog of music or videos.
Kinda makes the PMP experience seem a little awkward, at least to me. Also, I sold my PMP for almost exactly what it cost me to buy my phone and the extra MicroSD card. So, bonus there.
@met2art: Seconded. As I see it, PMPs can be either a.) a gateway drug for kids/folks with less money who want a crazy smartphone but aren't able to get a full-blown smartphone with a plan, or 2.) a dedicated music/media player that does a few things and does them well. If we're going to combine the two (and assuming money's not extremely tight), just make it a phone.
For my own life and needs, I use my G1. If I were to get anything, it might be a ZuneHD for the novelty, for the simplicity, and maybe the battery life. But the absolute last thing I wanna do is add a *second* myriad-function device.
@OCEntertainment: I definitely can see where a smaller more dedicated device would be handy for people who go jogging, or for workouts, etc. But I definitely don't need to carry around a bunch of devices that need various accoutrements and syncing when my G1 does 98% of what I need. As for battery life, I have a monster 2600mAh battery... my G1 is fat, but it lasts a couple days with the brightness at 100%, GPS on, 3G going, and emails, texts and phone calls through out the day. For that kind of functionality, I'm not concerned about the extra junk in the trunk. Also, I notice barely any battery drain from listening to music or long phone calls. It's video and WiFi that seem to run it down the fastest.
@Software_Goddess: Well, the least nerdy things I do are playing electric guitar (poorly) and drawing horror and/or sexy women. So, it's not like I have a whole lot to fall back on. Gotta grow where you're planted, and all... :)
09/16/09
If I were to use the music capabilities on my phone, I'd run those batteries out instead. This is bad.
Do we see the problem here? Until someone makes a phone that can get at least 12 hours of talk/music time with an average load from background apps at the same time, using a phone as a PMP isn't feasible. Similarly, the iPod Touch's ZOMG HUEG screen drains the battery faster than the small screen on my 5G iPod.
There's also tactile issues. I use my iPod in the car to pipe through the stereo. The iPod in general doesn't have the greatest tactile feedback, but the old school ones have something. You get nothing from a flat sheet of plastic.
Is it nice to have a music player in my phone? Absolutely! Is it, or will it ever be my primary player? Hell no.
09/16/09
just walk with the usb cable if you have a computer at work or just charge in your car
saying " will it ever be my primary player? hell no?" says that you dont plan for battery technology to advance?
09/17/09
09/16/09
09/16/09
09/16/09
Ballmer just chained a big concrete block to their new PMP and threw it into Puget Sound - it's already going down....
09/16/09
09/15/09
until the Zune get a decent App store like Apples, i dont know why people would prefer it over the touch.
Enjoy ur HD radio while i enjoy Assasins Creed on my iPod!!
Apple beating Microsoft in games field :), didnt expect to say that any day.
09/16/09
Enjoy playing Assasin's Creed on your iPod while I enjoy Assasin's Creed on my tv. :)
09/16/09
09/16/09
09/15/09
09/16/09
09/16/09
09/15/09
The iDisk app was both grossly late and severely lacking in robust features; the device isn't secure; the push email is still not 100% complete (GMail push please); and there is still a lot of kludge to simple features (Contacts on the phone are separate from contacts on MobileMe).
On top of that, the one feature I'd love to see for iTunes is notable by its absence - subscription pricing. I downloaded about 12 albums both before and after a great Reverend Horton Heat/Motorhead concert using ZunePass. Total cost: $15 per month. On iTunes, it would have been more expensive than a year's subscription to ZunePass.
Apple's App Store is getting very game-heavy and there is not a lot of movement on the iTunes front either.
I still think that subscription is a killer app which may help Zune get some legs. Apple is missing a window.
09/15/09
Now I don't completely understand Zune pass but I think I get the basic understanding. Correct me if I'm wrong. But if for any time I would need to cancel my subscription I loose all downloaded music expect for 1 album I get to keep every month. So after a year I've spent $180 to keep 12 albums. And that's only albums, not singles or certain tracks I wanted from an artist. It just doesn't seem like a good deal to me. I'd rather buy $180 of music each year that I selected weather that be singles, a couple singles, or albums.
I guess it could work if you download an assload of music every month. But I, and I think the majority of people, don't. Some months I don't want to spend any money on music. I have a great collection already, and between the last two months I've spent tops $10 on music. And who knows what I'll be buying in the upcoming months. Maybe nothing for the next 6 months, maybe an assload, but that's the reason I won't be purchasing my music on a subscription basis.
09/15/09
09/16/09
09/16/09
09/15/09
I'll stick with my Cowon S9. I can make the UI look however I want, it sounds bloody fantastic (kicks the shit out of a zune and ipod in that area, thank you very much) and it has mega battery life. That's all I want. I have a web browser on my phone, and facebook on my phone.
09/15/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
I miss real station wagons.
09/15/09
09/16/09
I have a hacked Palm Lifedrive, but it's getting more damaged as time passes...
I have to find a replacement device, but Palm Pre is not available here in Canada yet, and won't be on my network.
I was thinking about a Zune HD...
09/15/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
If a song comes that I don't like, I can easily change it by putting my hand into my pocket and pressing the button.
09/15/09
09/15/09
I need physical buttons, not a damn touch screen. I need it not to be my phone, as I actually use my phone a bit differently. Having music on my phone is nice for a backup, but it is more of a mixed media device, where my music player is dedicated to music only. At work, I can leave the music player tied to the stereo while I wander off with my phone somewhere. I don't need just one device, I need a really good and flexible music player. If that happens to be a Touch, so be it, but if I had my choice, it would be a Nano or Zune HD with a full-function physical remote, FM and HD radios and BT audio. Of course, I know I'm in the minority, but I love the size, weight and battery life of the smaller devices.
09/15/09
I think Apple has just brainwashed everybody beyond repair into hating buttons. If they're useful and straightforward, then it's worth having them.
09/16/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
The iPhone Touch is multipurpose device that evolved up from an MP3 player. But about a decade ago we had PDAs that were basically pocket computers that had simplified to fit the technologies of the time.
Back when the iPod was first released, I was already in love with my new iPaq PDA that allowed me to take my computer with me in a pocket computer form. With internet and apps, and even a video player.
The only difference is I wasn't restricted to using a proprietary media playerto put music and video on it, or buying "approved" apps that were allowed by HP.
09/15/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
the ipod touch in the pocket frightens me, especially while im at work. there's glass in 'em. they're fragile. and they take up quite a bit of pocket real estate.
i tend to use the clip for podcasts and as a portable flash drive, and for when i'm in situations where the ipod touch wouldn't fare well (be it getting dropped, getting scratched, or getting dunked)
as a primary device, the clip is barely adequate. but that's ok - it's expendable. I haven't put a lot of time into downloading apps, or amassing a huge library of music onto it. i wont be out hundreds of dollars if i destroy it.
i think dedicated, 'dumb' PMPs will persist for quite a while, even if they have to take a back seat to more expensive capable devices. because, lets face it, the iTouch isn't a mp3 player that can run apps. it's an app platform that also plays mp3s.
09/15/09
In fact, I'm even afraid to upgrade to a new phone in the fears that I'll scratch it, so I use a cheapo one.
I'm probably part of the minority here, but I suppose I'll have to upgrade sometime. I really like the functionality in the new generation of phones and media players that all my friends have. But then again, I've seen what happens to their devices after a bit of misuse or unfortunate technical hiccups...
09/17/09
09/15/09
09/15/09
Shame on me.
09/15/09
Kinda makes the PMP experience seem a little awkward, at least to me. Also, I sold my PMP for almost exactly what it cost me to buy my phone and the extra MicroSD card. So, bonus there.
09/15/09
For my own life and needs, I use my G1. If I were to get anything, it might be a ZuneHD for the novelty, for the simplicity, and maybe the battery life. But the absolute last thing I wanna do is add a *second* myriad-function device.
09/15/09
09/15/09
I think your nerd is showing.
09/15/09