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New York, 8:34 AM
Tue Nov 10
56 posts in the last 24 hours

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    Dsmvwl  Admin  Promote to frontpage Approve user Ban user ×
    Image of Sir Gibler Sir Gibler
    11/09/09

    In reply to HTC Touch HD2 Review: A Tragedy
    I'm just begging the cell phones gods that they let this phone sell horribly so that HTC has considers throwing some Android love its way. That and if AT&T would pick it up as its first Android handset. *runs to bed side, falls to knees, and prays*
     Reply
    Edited by Sir Gibler at 11/09/09 9:45 PM Sir Gibler was starred Sir Gibler was unstarred
    Image of 001 001
    11/09/09

    In reply to HTC Touch HD2 Review: A Tragedy
    Hi, I'm asking this stupid question cos I've never used WinMo.
    Quote:
    "It's not quite ready for stylus-free use, and the HD2's screen doesn't come with—or support—those forsaken almost-pens of yore. "

    Is this true?
    WinMo can't do without a stylus?
    Even fingernails won't do?

    If so, it's a dealbreaker. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    tande04 promoted this comment 001 was starred 001 was unstarred
    Image of tande04 tande04
    11/09/09

    @001: Yeah its a capacitive screen. There is nothing for the stylus to work with.

    That said I'm sure that any of the bevy of iPhone stylus would work if its really a deal breaker. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    tande04 was starred tande04 was unstarred
    Image of 001 001
    11/09/09

    @tande04:
    erm thanks? But I think you're not getting my question.

    I read the review on 6.5.
    It said that it'd be hard to use, not impossible, without a stylus. (who uses one anyway?)

    My point being I like the HD2, and if there are some settings that I'd rarely need to change, but which I could at least still use my fingernail when I need to then, I'm fine. The horror scenario being radio buttons placed so close together that'd require pinpoint accuracy that only a stylus could provide. Cos that's the impression Giz is giving me about WinMo.

    Regards to a capacitive screen, am wondering if the fingernail (keratin) is also a conductor? Cos what you're saying is that a stylus won't work cos it doesn't conduct, right?

    Hope you now understand better what I'd like to find out (if you're trying to help, that is).
    Thanks anyway.
    PS. Is being earnest a sin on Giz? #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    001 was starred 001 was unstarred
    Image of tande04 tande04
    11/09/09

    @001: Yeah, that was my earnest and real answer, maybe just to short and sweet.

    You can't use a fingernail. The reason a fingernail worked is the same reason that a stylus worked. It pushes in on the resistive screen and makes the connection that the screen registered as input. Thats not there on a capacitive screen. Your fingernail doesn't "conduct" (at least as far as touch screens are concerned, don't try sticking your fingernail in a light socket) and won't register on the screen.

    They really do make iPhone styluses (if that was the part that you thought was a joke). If it really comes down to being an issue its an option. 6.5 is supposed to be more touch friendly but as they mention (and you keyed in on) its not 100% there yet. There are menus and settings where they are pretty close together and a stylus would help. Its not going to be impossible (might take a couple tries) but it could be a hassle, especially if you have large fingers. Like I said though you could get a $2 pen that will work with the screen, throw it in a draw, and pull it out when you find yourself in one of those difficult menus so I wouldn't really think of it as a dealbreaker.
     Reply
    Edited by tande04 at 11/09/09 11:26 PM tande04 was starred tande04 was unstarred
    Image of Sandeep Murali Sandeep Murali
    11/09/09

    @001: You can use a finger or a fingernail on all WinMo phones. Prior to the HD2, all of them had resistive screens, which meant you could use a stylus as well. This was necessary in older WinMo ROMs because some buttons were tiny. However, in custom ROMs such as the ones skinned with HTC manila or by running SPB shell, you can get away with finger and nail use almost all the time.

    On the HD2 though, you'll need to use a finger and not a nail. From what I've seen, Sense UI covers almost everything and even the bits of WinMo that are left over have larger, finger friendly controls compared to WinMo 6.1.
     Reply
    Hobolicious promoted this comment Edited by Sandeep Murali at 11/09/09 11:24 PM Sandeep Murali was starred Sandeep Murali was unstarred
    Image of Lupus_Yonderboy Lupus_Yonderboy
    11/09/09

    @001: Unfortunately fingernails won't conduct (or perhaps won't conduct enough) and therefore can't be used as stylii (styluses?). I think that it's your "horror scenario" that's keeping John away - that he might be in a non-finger-friendly area of the OS, mucking around with something that Sense doesn't cover, the OS will need a stylus/stylus replacement (fingernail) but the capacitive touch screen won't have the ability to be used with one. To which I say: Trackball. Never thought that I'd be into it, but I have an HTC Hero and it's awesome for selecting some non-finger-friendly stuff, like links on a webpage that you don't want to have to expand the page to get to etc. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    tande04 promoted this comment Lupus_Yonderboy was starred Lupus_Yonderboy was unstarred
    Image of tande04 tande04
    11/09/09

    @Lupus_Yonderboy: I seldom if ever use my trackball. It seems like if I'm in an area so full of hyperlinks its just as much of a crap shoot trying to get the trackball to stay on one as it is trying to get my finger to hit one. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    tande04 was starred tande04 was unstarred
    Image of 001 001
    12:18 AM

    @tande04:
    man, that was an awesome answer, you addressed everything. Am thus enlightened but have unfortunately nothing to offer you in return but my gratitude and respect.

    PS. guilty as charged, thought the "iPhone stylus" was cheeky... #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    001 was starred 001 was unstarred
    Image of tande04 tande04
    12:27 AM

    @001: Glad I helped and I hope I restored some of your faith in Gizmodo commenters. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    tande04 was starred tande04 was unstarred
    Image of IN THE FACE! IN THE FACE!
    01:02 AM

    @001: I have a touch pro (WinMo 6.5 w/ no fancy-pants UI enhancements), and I never need the stylus, unless I'm using remote desktop to fix a server...

    I still have yet to see a remote access option on either the iPhone or Android that I would prefer over the trifecta available on WinMo (RDP, pcAnywhere, VNC), and WinMo has had RDP for nearly a decade... #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    IN THE FACE! was starred IN THE FACE! was unstarred
    Image of burnblue burnblue
    11/09/09

    In reply to HTC Touch HD2 Review: A Tragedy
    I don't understand this review. You say that HTC's replaced everything. So then is the replacement good? Where's the software review? Do you enjoy using the device? Past reviews have examined the earlier versions of TF3D, why not this?

    All that's done is to gloss over the software ("it's all HTC") without saying anything +ve or -ve about it, and the end with "It's still Windows Mobile."

    SO FREAKING WHAT? If the fact that the OS is Windows Mobile presents a problem, would it be so hard to point out what that problem is?

    Don't point to the 6.5 review, for two reasons. 1) That review was criticizing 6.5 for not being as much as it could/should be at this point, not that much of inspecting what's actually there on its own merit, but more importantly 2) Don't point to that review because you say HTC covers up everything!

    This review had very little to say, starts out in biased tone, and ends with the assumption that "it's Windows Mobile" explains everything. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    FredicvsMaximvs promoted this comment burnblue was starred burnblue was unstarred
    Image of Bokusatsu_Tenshi Bokusatsu_Tenshi
    11/09/09

    In reply to HTC Touch HD2 Review: A Tragedy
    Ok, I usually ignore posts bad mouthing Microsoft and polishing Apple's... apples on Gizmodo.

    But let me ask this one thing John, and I'll ask for something really hard here: if you completely forget HTC Touch HD2 has WinMo running under the UI how bad the software is compared to a similar Android phone or the iPhone?

    Because seriously, trolling and fanboyism apart, for someone reading this post alone, there is absolutely no real information that tells us why we should consider the software on the cellphone bad.

    Being able to replace all basic functions on a OS could be viewed as "trying to hide it", but it could also be seen as the OS being highly customizable.

    Lots of portable devices and computers uses highly customized Linux versions, and that's usually not because the manufacturer is trying to hide something... it's only trying to give it a different look to offer the users a fresh or more adequate UI to fit the hardware.

    Now, I'm guessing WinMo 6.5 is worse on benchmark, functions, bugs or whatever to justify that bias. Can't think of nothing else. And I'm really hoping there is a better reason for this review other than pure trolling. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Bokusatsu_Tenshi was starred Bokusatsu_Tenshi was unstarred
    Image of Kaiser-Machead Kaiser-Machead
    11/09/09

    In reply to HTC Touch HD2 Review: A Tragedy
    I also harbor a strong dislike for standard Windows Mobile, but if HTC covered up Winmo's interface beyond the first few panels and managed to get it to run smoothly, I'm willing to overlook all of those things, so long as it's not dependent on the stylus in any way (do not want).

    How much of an improvement would you say HTC's retelling of WinMo is over the standard version on other phones? #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Kaiser-Machead was starred Kaiser-Machead was unstarred
    Image of imTheKing imTheKing
    11/09/09

    @Kaiser-Machead: I think HTC needs to do what Motorola did and say "sorry no WinMo support, we're going with Android". #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Kaiser-Machead promoted this comment imTheKing was starred imTheKing was unstarred
    Image of Kaiser-Machead Kaiser-Machead
    11/09/09

    @imTheKing: That's possible, but I think that HTC's take on reskinning Windows Mobile looks pretty enticing. My primary complaint with prior versions of this was that it was more superficial, but it seems that HTC is dedicated to redesigning it as much as they can. If they can do it right and have the underpinnings of WM, you get the support of all of those apps, but none of what some people really did not like about the OS in the first place.

    Frankly, I'm not all that convinced that Android is really ready to take over in all respects anyway. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Kaiser-Machead was starred Kaiser-Machead was unstarred
    Image of MarcusMaximus MarcusMaximus
    11/09/09

    In reply to HTC Touch HD2 Review: A Tragedy
    After reading this, it left me confused. Most of the article was talking about the amazing hardware. Then it finally gets to the hated part(Windows Mobile) but doesn't really state any problems with it and just says that it's bad that it has it. Then the only negative is "it's still Windows Mobile", rather than any actual specific problems with the device.

    In fact it sounds like everything went perfectly smoothly in the actual implementation but the fact that it ran Windows Mobile(which has 0 effect on the actual experience) in the background was used as a negative.

    I don't care one way or the other if you don't like WinMo(I use Android myself) but at least give the reasons why it lowers the quality of the phone by stating problems experienced, areas where the UI gets killed, etc. As is, it was made to sound like the god phone that you(the author) hates for no reason whatsoever. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Hobolicious promoted this comment MarcusMaximus was starred MarcusMaximus was unstarred
    Image of imTheKing imTheKing
    11/09/09

    @MarcusMaximus: You can just search WinMo and look at the full review. Why should they rewrite it every single time they post an article? #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Hobolicious promoted this comment imTheKing was starred imTheKing was unstarred
    Image of MarcusMaximus MarcusMaximus
    11/09/09

    @imTheKing: "With Sense HTC has made a sort of meta-OS, which uses Windows Mobile 6.5 as a behind-the-scenes stagehand, which only shows its face when it absolutely needs to."

    That's why. If it has little to no effect on the actual user experience then it means absolutely nothing. I'm not asking him to say why he dislikes winmo, but how and where those facets he does dislike show themselves in this phone. If they don't, then the fact that it has winmo doesn't matter at all and it's back to sounding like it does now: This phone is amazing in every way. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    MarcusMaximus was starred MarcusMaximus was unstarred
    Image of Hobolicious Hobolicious
    11/09/09

    @imTheKing: What bothers me about this particular review is that there's no attempt to compare it to any other operating system.

    This is the first time Windows Mobile has been on hardware this advanced, and HTC has (from all accounts) done a bang-up job of making sure you don't see the underlying operating system, but it seems like the author is pissed that HTC isn't going to do an official Android port, and is taking it out on the device.

    I mean, isn't it a net WIN (pardon the pun) when the good things you have to say about the Sense UI include "surprisingly usable", "works surprisingly well" and "impressive", while the only concrete negative (besides vitriol about WinMo in general) about this handset in particular is that the Sense UI is "only marginally effective" at hiding WinMo.

    That's not a review of the software, that's just kinda lazy. At least compare the usability of the Sense UI on this hardware to something like Android 2.0 on the Droid. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Hobolicious was starred Hobolicious was unstarred
    Image of imTheKing imTheKing
    11/09/09

    @Hobolicious: So the end of the story is basically that HTC is trying to cover up WinMo as much as possible. That should explain it all no? #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    imTheKing was starred imTheKing was unstarred
    Image of Hobolicious Hobolicious
    11/09/09

    @imTheKing: Actually, no.

    The third paragraph that was added in the "Falling Out of Lust with the HD2" section addressed the bulk of my problems with the review as originally written.

    Now I know WHY the Sense UI doesn't particularly cut the mustard. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Hobolicious was starred Hobolicious was unstarred
    Image of MarcusMaximus MarcusMaximus
    11/09/09

    In reply to HTC Touch HD2 Review: A Tragedy
    Lovin the time. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Nick promoted this comment MarcusMaximus was starred MarcusMaximus was unstarred
    Image of Nick Nick
    11/09/09

    @MarcusMaximus: didn't even notice that. good eye. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Nick was starred Nick was unstarred
    Image of maxentropy maxentropy
    11/09/09

    @Nick: Fill me in, what's the significance of 1:37? #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    maxentropy was starred maxentropy was unstarred
    Image of NyC88Rican NyC88Rican
    11/09/09

    @maxentropy: 13:37 is just gamer speak for LEET. L33t, 1337.

    And leet or "Elite" just means, really really good. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    NyC88Rican was starred NyC88Rican was unstarred
    Image of Jux Jux
    11/09/09

    @NyC88Rican: Man, having to spell it out really takes a bit of the joy out of it. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Nick promoted this comment Jux was starred Jux was unstarred
    Image of Nick Nick
    11/09/09

    @Jux: and that is why i gave up on reading. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Nick was starred Nick was unstarred
    Image of not_a_virus.exe.vbs not_a_virus.exe.vbs
    11/09/09

    In reply to HTC Touch HD2 Review: A Tragedy
    I've been wondering this as well, since Sense runs so good why not just replace the whole Windows experience? HTC has the manpower to bang out their own OS, or just use Android as an underpinning. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    not_a_virus.exe.vbs was starred not_a_virus.exe.vbs was unstarred
    Image of smegz smegz
    11/09/09

    In reply to HTC Touch HD2 Review: A Tragedy
    Putting lipstick on a pig comes to mind when talking about WinMo on sexy hardware. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Thee Sea promoted this comment smegz was starred smegz was unstarred
    Image of Thee Sea Thee Sea
    11/09/09

    @smegz: I think a more accurate statement would be putting a pig on lipstick. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Thee Sea was starred Thee Sea was unstarred
    Image of Nick Nick
    11/09/09

    @Thee Sea: i am gonna need you to draw up a diagram. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Nick was starred Nick was unstarred
    Image of Thee Sea Thee Sea
    11/09/09

    @Nick: [i35.tinypic.com] #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Thee Sea was starred Thee Sea was unstarred
    Image of KassiaHaoe KassiaHaoe
    11/09/09

    In reply to HTC Touch HD2 Review: A Tragedy
    Blah blah Gizmodo hates Windows Mobile and never gives any HTC Phone with it a fair review blah blah nothing to see here. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Nick promoted this comment KassiaHaoe was starred KassiaHaoe was unstarred
    Image of Nick Nick
    11/09/09

    @KassiaHaoe: this comment, by essence of including the mobile OS that shall not be named, has been rated a 1 out of a lot more. poor form, sir. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Nick was starred Nick was unstarred
    Image of chizelord chizelord
    11/09/09

    In reply to HTC Touch HD2 Review: A Tragedy
    I love HTC's designs. Throw some Android in there and it would be darn near perfect. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    FigNinja promoted this comment chizelord was starred chizelord was unstarred
    Image of maxentropy maxentropy
    11/09/09

    In reply to HTC Touch HD2 Review: A Tragedy
    iphone killer?

    (sorry) #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    maxentropy was starred maxentropy was unstarred
    Image of Michael Scrip Michael Scrip
    11/09/09

    @maxentropy:

    Other Windows Mobile phone killer.

    the iPhone has had an incredible head start at this point. I'd love to hear the sales pitch to someone who walks into a store to buy an iPhone and they walk out with an HD2.

    The HD2 is an amazing piece of hardware... but it's still gonna compete with that pesky iPhone... #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Thee Sea promoted this comment Michael Scrip was starred Michael Scrip was unstarred
    Image of Thee Sea Thee Sea
    11/09/09

    @Michael Scrip: No it won't. In a business environment the iPhone is pretty much ignored in favour of Blackberry and WinMo devices. Yes, you will find businessmen with an iPhone but they've probably got a Blackberry or whatever flavour of the month WinMo phone came out 6 months ago in their other pocket. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Thee Sea was starred Thee Sea was unstarred
    Image of DoogieFullHouser DoogieFullHouser
    11/09/09

    @Thee Sea: That was the case, and sure it, but I'm starting to see a surprising shift. I was at a VC/Entrepreneur dinner last week and they had all the iPhone users hold up their handsets. I couldn't believe the number of C(E,T,F,M)O's that we're carrying iPhones around. Of course they may have been carrying a Blackberries too... but still. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Thee Sea promoted this comment DoogieFullHouser was starred DoogieFullHouser was unstarred
    Image of Thee Sea Thee Sea
    11/09/09

    @DoogieFullHouser: They were probably carrying iPhones around because they actually do something a bit better than RIM and WinMo devices do:

    Make calls without sucking. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Thee Sea was starred Thee Sea was unstarred
    Image of Michael Scrip Michael Scrip
    11/09/09

    @Thee Sea:

    Well that's a different argument altogether. Business vs. Consumer.

    Companies have their own reasons for choosing either Windows Mobile for Exchange support or BES for enterprise Blackberry support.

    But, the iPhone is a consumer device... that plays music, movies, apps, games, etc... and it can *also* check corporate email.

    So, again, I still don't think the HD2 will be an iPhone killer. Do you really think there will be 30 million HD2s sold in 3 years? Doubtful. Are there over 30 million Windows Mobile platform devices in the world... in companies who already use Exchange in their corporations? Probably.

    But that's not the measure of an iPhone killer... #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    Michael Scrip was starred Michael Scrip was unstarred
    Image of DoogieFullHouser DoogieFullHouser
    11/09/09

    @Thee Sea: D_d yo_ m__n th_ o_her wa_ arou_d, beca_s_ m_ iP_on_ is _lwa_s cu_t_ng o_t an_ m_st pe__le I ta_k to _ay t_e sam_ t_ing. #htctouchhd2review
     Reply
    DoogieFullHouser was starred DoogieFullHouser was unstarred
    Image of bonedog73 bonedog73
    11/06/09

    In reply to HD Media Player Battlemodo: Apple TV Killers
    Will any of these give me Hulu on my TV? I need something that will do that. I have a roku and ps3.
     Reply
    Edited by bonedog73 at 11/06/09 10:57 AM bonedog73 was starred bonedog73 was unstarred
    Image of Cash907Censored Cash907Censored
    11/06/09

    In reply to HD Media Player Battlemodo: Apple TV Killers
    I got my dad the WD HD TV last Christmas, and he loves it. I love it because it just works right out of the box and plays every format I throw at it, yet it's simple enough for a 65 year old man who's afraid of the iPhone to use. I bought a 2 pack of seagate 2.5" external drives from Sams Club for 130 bucks back in January, and once a month I'll pop over to my folks house and swap out the drives, leaving him with fresh movies and tv episodes to watch. He loves to brag to his friends about how his kid is so sneaky, and gets him "Hollywood movies that are still in theaters."
    He's happy, I'm happy, WD TV gets two thumbs up. #hdmediaplayers
     Reply
    Cash907Censored was starred Cash907Censored was unstarred
    Image of bigdave914 bigdave914
    11/06/09

    @Cash907Censored: The WDTV is the first gen with out ethernet, this article is about the WDTV Live also know as WDTV 2. Its got eithernet and some other differences. #hdmediaplayers
     Reply
    Cash907Censored promoted this comment bigdave914 was starred bigdave914 was unstarred
    Image of Cash907Censored Cash907Censored
    11/06/09

    @bigdave914:
    Yeah, I'm aware of that thanks. Thanks to a recent firmware update, the only difference between the WD HD TV and the WD TV Live (version reviewed above) is the newer model has an ethernet port. #hdmediaplayers
     Reply
    Cash907Censored was starred Cash907Censored was unstarred
    Image of KassiaHaoe KassiaHaoe
    11/05/09

    In reply to HD Media Player Battlemodo: Apple TV Killers
    Why is it called "Apple TV Killers" if you think Apple TV is a poor product?
     Reply
    Duckspwn:Loves Approving Reds promoted this comment KassiaHaoe was starred KassiaHaoe was unstarred
    Image of Duckspwn Duckspwn
    11/05/09

    @KassiaHaoe: Because they killed Apple TV in terms of performance? #hdmediaplayers
     Reply
    Duckspwn was starred Duckspwn was unstarred
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