Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste" - Gizmodo Comments

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Xenocide — Mon, 25 Feb 2008 15:19:37 EST

@mandarin: Obviously you have never used a Vaio. They are very nice laptops.

Xenocide

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

An0nymouse — Mon, 25 Feb 2008 12:34:43 EST

"Cutting costs doesn't always improve the final product."

Cutting extra unneeded parts (or just replacing them with with another method of securing components works as well) does decrease time put into manufacturing, efficiency, and the overall price.

To the people saying why don't they make something better themselves if the MacBook Air is so bad, I say this: Do critics of novels always write their own novels? The Japanese are known to aim for efficiency and space. They know best on this subject I think. (Fitting all they do into their small little island.)

I don't know their exact sales, but lets take this for example: it takes 30 screws alone for the keyboard, and said screws cost $.10 each. If they produced 100,000 MBAs, that makes the cost for the keyboard's screws $10,000 alone. That's an incredible amount. And incredible amount of waste.

Just think about it.

An0nymouse

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Neoistheone2000 — Mon, 25 Feb 2008 11:56:18 EST

@DeadWriter: Yeah, Just ask Microsoft about the Xbox 360....

Then again we are talking about apple.... so the prices are gonna be high....

Neoistheone2000

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

tastybytes — Mon, 25 Feb 2008 10:04:45 EST

why are apple people so blind to anything that might suggest that there is a way to improve apple products. there is a way to improve everything. the second you stop believing something can be improved, you might as well stop breathing. bottom line is apple does some things better, windows does some things better, linux does some things better, but all of these can be improved, that is why there are new versions. having apple's worst critic tear their machine apart is probably the best thing they could want. this wasnt even directed at apple, it was directed at design post-manufacturing. cheaper manufacturing usually means cheaper price for the consumer (ok, maybe not with apple stuff) but at least lower manufacturing costs ensure that products like the air will continue to be made.

tastybytes

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

elmnopo — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 23:48:31 EST

@ctthoqqua: Just the one Dell. I've dropped it countless times, including once from over 6ft (um, yeah, beer was involved--don't ask) and it still works. Not a crack in the screen, but the case is a little bent in one corner. It's still what I use to read Giz and type this comment to you. :)

elmnopo

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Maxwells_Nylon_Hammer — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 20:46:26 EST

@Jason: THANK YOU!!!
Why didn't they just rivet the thing together, it's not like it's repairable.

Maxwells_Nylon_Hammer

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

krom — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 20:00:20 EST

@draconis2941: It's been the Japanese engineering tradition of reducing costs and waste that has made them a international business power.
nice, made me a good laugh. when was the last time you had a look at the nikkei? They 'were' and international business power not they 'are'.
Also paying 1300$ for a 800$ notebook, are you kidding me? since when you pay for something what the actual price 'should' be?

Also, more screws = more waste? What a joke. Take it apart replace parts and ervything with a screwdriver. No glue, rivets, wathever to break up and put somehow together again.

This article looks at the Air from a strikt economical point of view, saying that apple is stupid in producing at such high cost, when they could produce on lower cost and sell the damn thing for the same price with a higher profit.

krom

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

daaniel — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 06:47:43 EST

They then go on to claim that they "can't find anything technically superior" about it and that they could "make the same computer at a lower cost."

Go on. Make it then.

daaniel

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

RoDe — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 02:45:02 EST

Also bare in mind that Apple, has a reputation of changing a design even after the product started shipping. So we might and up with MBA kept together with sticky tape.

RoDe

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

PackerX — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 02:38:13 EST

I think Apple is far more concerned about having a reliable product. Yes, eliminating those screws could probably knock 3 minutes off the assembly time for each unit and reduce cost by about twenty cents. But how many customer service issues would that cost?

From a manufacturing standpoint, fewer screws is better. From a product support standpoint, spend the extra dollar and prevent problems down the road.

PackerX

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Gary_7vn — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 01:38:16 EST

@Vash21: There is clearly something wrong with your brain. The United States spends more than the rest of the world combined on defense. They are in a class by themselves. This fact is irrelevant to your argument, it is a non sequitur (feel free to look that term up on Google).

Japan is obligated to spend less than 1% of its GDP on defense and for that they get a self defense force that is adequate, more than adequate to defend themselves from any likely enemy. You are mixing up offense with defense. "guess wat they are part of a legitamite army that can declare war.. and is in one!" WTF does that mean? Why can't you spell? Just how abysmally stupid are you? What does this tortured, convoluted and irrelevant 'sentence' have to do with your original contention? Do you even know what a "contention" is?

And where do you get your information, do you pull it from the air, or from your diseased mind? And by the way, you racist asshole, they are called Japanese not fucking "Japs". The Japanese had a high level of civilization when your ancestors were painting themselves blue and eating carrion.

Japan does not need the USA to defend them. You are wrong. You obviously can't help it, it is a product of your various mental deficiencies. If you want respect here, or anywhere, learn to spell, use proper grammar and stop calling a nation of people whose boots you are not fit to lick, racist epithets like Jap.

Can't defend themselves? Tell that to the 27,909 casualties, with 6,825 killed in action at Iwo Jima.

Gary_7vn

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Vash21 — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 00:52:53 EST

@datafox:
@poisonfist:
@Gary_7vn:

wow when i said earlier there is always someone on the internet that knows a little more i didnt mean the noobs above that can google japan and look @ wikipedia and come back with half baked facts. I'll try and simplify it once again for you. Japan's "military" is a peacekeeping military and is still prohibited. There are STILL US troops stationed in Japan and guess wat they are part of a legitamite army that can declare war.. and is in one!
and the next time you idiots look up facts and numbers look a little farther... 5th in the world? hah thats 40 billion, the US spends 400 billion, Jap spends .8% of their GDP and the US spends ~3.5% so next time please dont try and depend on google, try and use that thing u might call a brain, but u might want to check wikipedia's opinion on that one first before you reply

Vash21

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Gary_7vn — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 23:57:41 EST

@C.S.M. Technophile: If you save $5 dollars over 1 million units... pretty soon you are talking real money.

Gary_7vn

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Gary_7vn — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 23:35:46 EST

@Vash21: America defends Japan from nothing or no one, the Japan Self Defense Force is one of the most capable in the world, they spend much more each year than the Chinese. Their equipment and training is superb. Most analysts agree that the Japanese could assemble nuclear weapons and repurpose existing delivery systems in a matter of a few months.

Japanese people want the Americans out, they are sick of drunk GI's beating people up and sexually assaulting their women. They don't need you and they don't want you.

How's that Ford Taurus working out for you?

Gary_7vn

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

caffeinated-reading-machine — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 22:18:38 EST

Why don't we have a product with European external design, Japanese internal mechanism, and American marketing campaign?

caffeinated-reading-machine

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Gary_7vn — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 21:06:38 EST

It's called "kaizen" ie "continuous improvement", it's the number one Japanese manufacturing ethic. The idea is simple, "we can make it better". Better can mean cheaper with the same quality, or more efficiently using less parts. Extra parts are extra parts. There is something to be said for over-engineering, but it comes at a price - literally.

I remember way back in the day, when Jobs insisted that Mac's look as good on the inside as they did on the outside. I think it was the Lisa where the designers had virtual signatures on the inside of the case.

It the machine is just a strong with less screws, then they should use less screws.

Gary_7vn

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Franssu — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 15:12:25 EST

@Stang70Fastback: Hmmm. Did you ever tear a Dell laptop down ?
You wouldn't believe how many screws there are just in the top part, to hold the screen and the case around it. In fact I did as another commenter said, use only half of the screws when putting it all together back. And It's not going apart in any way, I'm typing on it right now...

Fanboy : noun. Someone that wouldn't let reality get in the way of his beliefs. As in "Those Apple fanboy's can't even acknowledge that their company of choice has completely lost its touch in the past year."

Franssu

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

LEXX911 — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 14:10:53 EST

I see why some people here are either stupid or retarded. Why not try to look at a bigger picture? How about multiplying 10screws X 1,000,000?

Touch screen phone will also help cut down alot on waste without all the buttons and components.

Same thing can also apply to DVD vs Blu ray. DVD produces much much more waste than Blu-ray disc. A DVD produces 10x more waste than a 50gig Blu-ray or HD discs.

LEXX911

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

SuperMacGuy — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 13:25:30 EST

Screws mean you can take it apart AND put it back together. Without breaking off cheapo plastic single use clips.

SuperMacGuy

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

NotMe — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 12:35:10 EST

@SeventhExile:

I've yet to meet the industrial engineer that is qualified to actually design anything. Industrial engineers are not mechanical engineers. I think you're confused.

Industrial and manufacturing engineers figure out how much something is going to cost to manufacture, purchase factory equipment, do time studies and set piece rates, etc., and they're important disciplines, but they're not mechanical engineers. IE's are not qualified to do mechanical design and FEA, and wouldn't really have any idea whether 30 screws were needed or not.

NotMe

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Bachus_snowman — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 11:53:07 EST

Yeah, I fully agree with you. 120 comments on a bunch of screws- is there more to come after the next sunrise ?

Anyway, I can never agree that the Japanese makes the best things in the world anyway. Any which way you look at it... Cars (rolls) .. camera (hasselblad)... camera lens .. Zenith ... watches (rolex, omega) and so on.

hence my thought process says that they created things for the mass and never an engineering marvel! They have a huge marketing division...

It's easy to edit someones masterpiece, or sit in the stands and tell the players in the field how to win the game!

So this crack team who did the SCREW job on the MBA, should make something better and challenge Steve Jobs.

Having said that, a stitch in time saves nine, and a screw extra will show it's true girth after the lappie takes a mighty fall.

Bachus_snowman

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

frigg — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 11:07:11 EST

This thread is wasteful. There's around 120 comments in it. Our team of Japanese-based commenters could have easily provided equivalent feedback in no more than 80 comments.

frigg

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

DelSource — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 06:24:22 EST

Puh. What on earth could the Japanese teach the Americans about miniaturisation and high quality electronics manufacture?

Oh no, hang on a seco

DelSource

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Sat, 23 Feb 2008 03:52:46 EST

I don't get the screws thing. Sony, who's quite on the japanese league, also covers the innards of its pro and semi-pro machines as well as low end consumer gadgets with screws, so what, they too are wasting?

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

poisonfist — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 02:05:24 EST

@matt buchanan: I found it very amusing too. I wasn't really complaining about your interpretation though, rather the Nikkei article in English vs Japanese. :-)

poisonfist

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

poisonfist — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 02:02:35 EST

@Vash21: Japan's military budget is quite high you know (5th in the world), and no need for calling us by a derogatory term.

poisonfist

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

datafox — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 01:36:47 EST

@Vash21:

I remember Japan Self Defense Force (JDSF) so Japan actually has a military force they pay for. I am surprised an expert like you missed that.

Also you might want to go back to retake an English course.

datafox

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

shmokes — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 00:58:37 EST

Guys, they aren't saying that the manufacturer should have just left screws out. They're saying that the designers send the design to the manufacturers and the manufacturers can improve the design, by reducing superfluous screws, etc. It's not like you would open your laptop and notice a bunch of missing screws. They'd redesign the extra screw holes right out of there. Keep in mind, it wouldn't have a Made in Taiwan sticker on it . . . it would have a Made in Japan sticker on it.

shmokes

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

MrBlahBlah — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 00:12:12 EST

i bet the number of screws is directly related to the sturdynes of the laptop.

MrBlahBlah

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

jamar0303 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 23:26:09 EST

@ctthoqqua: "My five-year-old Powerbook G4 disagrees with the need for fewer screws. Not a dent or scratch or twist in it.

How many laptops have you bought in five years?"
Three; one every year when I was on a Mac kick (I had a Powerbook G4 too- it died within a year due to heavy case and LCD damage over the course of a normal school year) and now my Panasonic Toughbook. It's pretty much proved that Macs aren't enough for the price (and with OSx86 I don't have to worry about missing the ease of use that comes with Mac either)

jamar0303

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

rexdot — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 22:59:30 EST

alpha beta

rexdot

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

VakeroRokero — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 22:58:33 EST

does that mean japanese engineers are coming up with something more advanced? cool... when??

VakeroRokero

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

_udo_ — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 22:12:16 EST

There is no doubt that fewer screws will reduce the assembly cost of any product. But does it reduce waste?

Do fewer screws make a product easier to repair? Certainly not.

I have repaired many screw-less appliances without instructions. Repairs takes several times as long compared to products that use screws in critical places. And I hate to say it, but many times I marked the product, while exploring how to take it apart.

I do read the labels: "No repairable parts inside." I do ignore them too. Many failed screw-less, no-production-waste products are thrown away, even though they have only an easy to fix problem, because repairs are too difficult, or impossible, for the average person. This causes a big waste!

_udo_

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Vash21 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 22:08:29 EST

@draconis2941:

actually is more that the US protects the Japanese with OUR army and we pay for THEIR protection so the japs are able to pump that much more into consumer electronics instead of on military tech. but nice try, Japans protection and by result it's technological success is in a way America's apology for Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Next time you try to make a analytical comment on a economy or culture just know sum1 knows sumthing u dont... so get ownt

Vash21

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

narcolepticdoc — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 21:44:54 EST

I would much rather have a computer that was held together by screws than one that had stupid little clips and one catches and snap together bits.

It's a total pain the the rear to disassemble products that are made that way, because they are designed to be put together. Once. Once you've bent or broken those clips, nothing will put humpty dumpty back together again the same way.

Now something that has been elegantly designed and screwed together, that's a joy to work on. Pieces just lift out.

narcolepticdoc

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

CSX321 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 21:37:24 EST

@ppiddy:
That reminds me of something I always used to say at my former programming job: We, the developers, knew everything about how the software was supposed to work. However, the tech services people knew how it actually worked.

CSX321

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Syndication — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 21:22:51 EST

@Beerad:

I'd say making $40,000 in NYC and buying a macbook air would make you fall into the trendsetter in debt view.

Syndication

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Sailorcancer — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 21:09:45 EST

"The high build cost is "astonishing" to Nikkei's teardown squad. They then go on to claim that they "can't find anything technically superior" about it and that they could "make the same computer at a lower cost."

Where have they been for the last couple of years?

Sailorcancer

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

geschmidtt — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 21:02:46 EST

I will take the Lenovo X300, Thank you.

geschmidtt

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

ten10 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 20:58:36 EST

It's always better to leave some space for improvement for the next product :)

ten10

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

dw2surf — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 20:29:58 EST

@ j4sk868: The of majority of dell's i have seen and used hold up pretty well. And this is coming from a person with one of the biggest p.o.s. that dell made, an inspiron 5150

And do you actually need 30 screws to hold a keyboard together???

dw2surf

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

spgass — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 20:13:52 EST

30 screws doesn't sound like a major problem. The bigger problem is their questionable marketing claim to be selling the world's thinnest notebook:

spgass

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Tired_ — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 20:05:02 EST

@Xavoc: And sometimes More + Less > Nothing.

(More + Less^2)/Better <= Intel?

Tired_

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

mandarin — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:49:46 EST

Which is why Sony sucks

mandarin

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

soggy_cheerio — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:46:29 EST

@SeventhExile: It amazes me how oblivious to the concept this whole thread has been.

soggy_cheerio

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

StoopidCow — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:42:57 EST

@dallasmay2:
Did u even read the linked article?? They are saying that :
"one of the factors behind such a structure was the laptop's manufacturing plant, which apparently did not give any technical feedback to Apple."
"we guess Apple is not paying much attention to both workmanship of the hardware design and comprehensive cost reduction."

It's funny how apple fanboys associate "cutting cost" = Walmart or Dell..
Product's cost-effectiveness is the first thing you learn in college..

StoopidCow

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

ppiddy — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:41:59 EST

@adamsorkin: You are the only one who mentioned Lean. Cookie for you!

This is an absolutely fundamental principle to good manufacturing: the designers and engineers are not gods. No one has a more vested interest in making assembly easy (and hence, cheap) than the guy who has to put in all 30 screws.

More screws mean more things to loose and cause a failure in the product. It may mean more time spent disassembling it for repair. It means more spots where a technician might forget a step. It means longer assembly times and longer queues and lower productivity. So what if it only adds $3 to the cost of the product? It's $3 wasted.

The Japanese way of doing things is to shoot for one failure per one MILLION parts. That's why Toyota and Honda have been kicking the asses of western manufacturers for the last 25 years. There's no "ahh, the process is dialed in now, lets crank out a bunch of stuff totally mindlessly." Continuous improvement is built into the ethos in a way that is totally anathema to how western engineers think. Here's a fun exercise in futility for you: try telling a German engineer that he's wrong because the techs are having a hard time getting all the screws in right.

As someone who has actually spent time working with technicians on manufacturing lines, I know that they guy doing the assembly knows all sorts of stuff that the engineer doesn't, and vice versa. Good engineers know this and have a certain degree of humility about it. Period.

Incidentally, this is one of the drawbacks of farming out manufacturing to some third world country and not having the process be two-way. You lose the vital feedback that you get from talented assembly line workers.

ppiddy

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

urban_ninjya — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:37:29 EST

Considering that the Japanese are the height of Zenness and athetically pleasing products, they should should be able to understand why Steve wanted the design this way.

Not only does it have to be symetric, it has to have a lucky number of screws.

It's rumored that there are 2008 parts total, the year in which MacBook Air is released.

urban_ninjya

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

SeventhExile — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:31:06 EST

Its called industrial engineering..
you know.. the only engineering field thats actually growing - not shrinking..

muda - is the buzz word for wast.. its the idea that the product can always be improved - 30 screws are un-needed.. re-engineer the product to use 9 screws or such - cut the time it takes to make the product and the price.. thus use the extra money to continue improvements or give a price cut to the populous..

this idea of industrial engineering is the reason Japaneses products most often outlast,out preform and are on average cheaper then most other profits.

SeventhExile

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

marco916 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:21:58 EST

Just my 0.02 cents as a computer repair tech, breaking down any laptop either it be Mac Book, Dell,HP they all have hundreds of screws, "not hundreds, but you get my point" laptops are a little more time consuming to work on. But one thing that makes Apple products sell especially is the knowledge of the staff, I always have customers of mine that ask me what laptop should I buy, I make them go out and do there own shopping comparison, majority of my customers come back and explain how knowlowegde the Apple staff our, how impressed they were about the products and the ins and outs. When they go to either Best Buys, Circuit City, Fry's here in the States, the sells staff don't really know except how fast it is, how much memory it has and what 3, 5 year warranties they can see you. So I assume the Apple staff in Japan are probably just as good sales people as in the States. So it also depends how you're treated in the store, I believe that's why MAC shit costs little more then the Dell's, HP's.. You basically get better service.

But we also do the same here in the States, especially to Japanese cars, kids are always making them go faster, adding this and that, headers ,exhaust, chipping it out. We judge all products and make them better also in the States.

marco916

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

j4sk868 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:17:49 EST

@Stang70Fastback: Because Dell computers are the worst thing a consumer could ever buy.

j4sk868

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

dallasmay2 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:09:55 EST

"The MacBook Air gives me an impression that its manufacturing plant packaged the computer exactly as ordered by Apple."

I like how he said that as if manufacturing the product to specification is a bad thing.

It's almost like he said, "Sure, we could do it like we were told to and make the product top of the line, but then it wouldn't be cheap Wal-Mart crap."

dallasmay2

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

discounteggroll — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:03:47 EST

me thinks these guys haven't taken apart an iBook lately. that computer has so many mofo screws it's ridiculous.

and on a side note, the MBA has 43 total screws (I just took a look at the Apple take-apart guide for it). I would rather have the assurance of more than 1 screw holding the separate boards in their place (knowing other apple techs, they don't always end up with all the screws in their correct places, let alone ending up with too few/too many after doing a repair)

discounteggroll

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

pantsonfireliarliar — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:03:40 EST

Hmmm, as long as we're talking keyboards with excessive screws, the Sony Vaio CR series is a Japanese computer (I'm assuming produced in Japan) with a similar keyboard to the Air (minus the backlighting). IF this keyboard follows the same philosophy of less waste as the Japanese engineers believe in, then I'll take Apple's 30 screws; the Sony keyboard just feels cheap compared to the Air (or even the MacBook).

pantsonfireliarliar

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Scuba Steve — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 19:03:11 EST

@Onouris: Go easy on him. Our public schools don't provide a decent cultural education on the differences in Asian continent.

Scuba Steve

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Bueller — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:55:42 EST

Macbook Air: It's full of stars!

Bueller

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

longshot — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:53:43 EST

I trust the guy who builds the computers, not the ones who design them.

longshot

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

llryuujinll — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:51:43 EST

@peacefulpony: Lenovo is chinese not japanese co. all Asians may look the same but they come from totally different countries.. =oP

llryuujinll

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

peacefulpony — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:48:16 EST

Xavoc, you obviously haven't read this article.

[www.businessweek.com]

peacefulpony

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

ghmlco — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:41:09 EST

@fastm3driver

I'm just fine with the weight if that's what it takes to make a solid product that doesn't flex and creak and give and generally feel like a typical plastic Sony ultralight.

ghmlco

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Xavoc — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:40:40 EST

@peacefulpony: Lenovo is a Chinese company actually.

I think Mac folk defend their machines, because people like to dig at them about owning a mac. Personally I don't care what someone owns as long as they don't ask or expect me to fix it for them when it breaks.

Xavoc

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

peacefulpony — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:38:20 EST

Yes, the Japanese have engineered something 'better' than the MBA: Lenovo X300.

But really, MBA owners need to get a grip on their emotions. There's no need to defend Apple, they are doing quite well, even in Japan.

peacefulpony

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Evil_Snow_Man — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:26:51 EST

@officeboy: Winner!

Evil_Snow_Man

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

bryanoak — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:23:06 EST

Wow, those Japanese engineers really made sense of it!

On the other hand, if it's so easy to do a better job; why haven't they?

bryanoak

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

quikboy — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:23:03 EST

I knew it was full of waste. Too bad for those eco-sites pushing the MBA as something "innovative" and green.

quikboy

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

morbo — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:17:08 EST

They are nitpicking at a 1st gen product? Lets open up some Japanese 1st gen prods... A SonyD5 CD player, PS2, PS3 etc. When you engineer a first gen product, no engineering team wants to take a chance that their block/section is optimized to a lack of utility. Later, once the product gets some traction, then you go back and fine tune. How many PS2 gens were there? At least 7 I think or more. Those Japanese engineers need to give it a rest and focus on their own prods.

morbo

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

peacefulpony — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:17:07 EST

Maybe, just maybe, these engineers know what they are talking about and the MBA does use a ridiculous amount of screws. Is there any indication that their assessment is wrong?

And, does it really matter what nationality these engineers come from?

peacefulpony

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

aelver — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:14:10 EST

Why not just superglue that entire sucker together ... no 'waste' what-so-ever.

You'll probably save maybe 5 grams in weight too :P

aelver

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

matt buchanan — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:08:51 EST

@poisonfist: I just found their hangup on the number of screws to be amusing, and entirely what I would expect at the same time.

matt buchanan

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

kipmartin — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:02:12 EST

if they could have done it better, why didnt they? the Air is selling better than projected--and it had adventurous sales expectations to begin with.

the Air wasnt designed to be cheap, affordable, or price slashing. people involved in pricing theory know that overpricing sometimes boosts the cache of a product--like the Isuzu-built Saab, the Ford-built Jaguar, and the Taylor guitar.

the Air is Apple's flagship. of course it costs a lot--people spend extra for 'cool'. and the Air, though not a technology marvel, IS cool. its the 3 series BMW of the computer world.

kipmartin

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

C.S.M. Technophile — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 18:01:43 EST

Wow. They're SCREWS! I'm almost positive that it's not really that big of a cost or waste. MacBook Air with 30 = $1800. MacBook Air with 5 = (maybe) $1795. And as small as all of these screws are, I don't think it's really causing a shortage of materials. I'd be more worried about all of the cars that get dumped in a pile every day than 30 screws.

C.S.M. Technophile

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

tabaks — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:59:56 EST

Umm, funny, I always thought that Japanese like things full of...waste...hehehehhh.

tabaks

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

cy3 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:59:53 EST

OMG, WE CAN MAKE THE Air EVEN LITER!

wait, so this laptop has more of stuff that we DON'T need and not enough things we DO need?
man, Apple rly screwed us over, in more ways than one

cy3

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

McLucky — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:59:37 EST

@tokyobob: Yeah I actually escaped a few years back but you have a good point, there is such a thing as good Japanese design but you'll have to admit most everything in Japan is design by committee for the lowest common denominator.

I agree though that a lot of Sony products (and a few other brands) now combine some nice design with function but that raises question of Sony's planned obsolescence business model etc.

McLucky

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

tokyobob — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:53:46 EST

@McLucky: have you looked at the new Toshiba SS RX1 ? ,Sony X505/SP or any of the Sony range.

The Japaneses do make some nice looking stuff and some really ugly stuff but that being said it usually works well .

Maybe it time you to leave Japan ?

tokyobob

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

thetazman — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:48:50 EST

@Xavoc (04:47 PM): A nice way to put it... more or less.

thetazman

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Crazysamz — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:43:16 EST

@Kaiser-Machead: I disagree, the lotus elise is actually my favorite car, but the Lotus elise is actually still fast, and the MBA is still pretty fast, but still not as good as a Lotus elise. Maybe it wouldn't be a smartcar, but something like the Aptera typ-1 (except that the Aptera is actually well priced for what it does)

Crazysamz

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Kaiser-Machead's LEGO WALL-E — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:42:14 EST

@mikesfree: Macbook's only been around long enough to see one OS upgrade.

Kaiser-Machead's LEGO WALL-E

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

SneakerFiend — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:37:25 EST

@Stang70Fastback: LMAO!
usually when you pay more for somethinq you get higher quality.
IDK what those guys in Japan want a computer that has a high risk of not working after being on for 24hours or that can stay on for more than a week and not have any problems.
IDK japan rxcks but some of those smaller company's ways are utterly ridiculous.

SneakerFiend

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

mikesfree — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:35:57 EST

@ctthoqqua:

Interesting, my dell lasted for about 6 years, replaced last month. I think thats all up to the buyer, if you buy a low end machine, you are going to replace more often or not have the functionality. I paid about $1200 for it back in the day, upgraded the ram and hd along the way for about another $150. How much was the macbook? Have you had to upgrade anything or buy a new os version or two?

mikesfree

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Kaiser-Machead's LEGO WALL-E — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:35:51 EST

@Crazysamz: So the Air would be more like the Lotus Elise. It's expensive, not as powerful, not as practical per lack of certain common amenities, but does deliver properly in key areas.

Kaiser-Machead's LEGO WALL-E

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

rdldr1 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:35:17 EST

@tokyobob: Im not comparing the PS3 to the 360. Im just saying that the first generation of anything will be more streamlined in subsequent revisions. The PS3 is cheaper now because of its revisions.

rdldr1

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

tokyobob — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:33:16 EST

The reason the MBA has so many screws is to ensure thats it's easy to take apart to replaced the battery etc .. it's way better than having hidden clips that break off

its a better design for the case atleast ....

tokyobob

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

adamsorkin — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:33:06 EST

Toyota pioneered lean manufacturing and design, by working from the assumption that people, technology, and processes worked together to produce a quality product that reflected the user's needs and wants without being overengineered or shoddy. They also assumed that the guy on the manufacturing floor knew his job better than anybody else, and gave her input into the process accordingly - the point isn't so much to make things cost less - it's to make them not cost more than they have to...

adamsorkin

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

mikesfree — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:29:50 EST

@jetexas:

That is one of the best comments ever!

Really though, Mac ought to be using concurrent design processes to include production engineers. If they could lower the cost by reducing wastes, it would be better for everyone.

mikesfree

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

slurpee_machine_technician — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:28:19 EST

Back when I was working as a Slurpee Machine Technician in New Deli I could replace the entire compressor in under 15 minutes. It had 8 screws.

7-11 does not allow the same Slurpee Machines in the US. The US Machines have 12 screws holding the compressor in.

In New Deli we had to transport the Slurpee Machines by Camel and sometimes the compressors would break loose during the trek across the desert. This made me wish that we had the 7-11 authorized Slurpee Machines with the extra screws.

I can't type anymore it's time for my daily prayer to Allah.

slurpee_machine_technician

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

McLucky — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:28:17 EST

Well after living in Japan for a decade I can safely say two things:

1. If we left the design of the MacBook Air to Japanese engineers we would end up with a product both ugly and hard to use. Possibly sheathed in concrete.

2. If we left the design to anyone in Japan we would end up with a laptop that has some "cute" cartoon character splashed all over it.

Seriously if they can do better we'd all love to see it but saying and doing are pretty far apart in this case.

McLucky

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

tokyobob — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:27:32 EST

@rdldr1: ehh the PS3 was nicely designed and it has more power than a 360 and doesn't sound like a dustbuster Oh and it doesn't have a 16 pct failure rate like the 360

And the newer ones are cheaper

tokyobob

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Crazysamz — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:27:30 EST

@AlphaUltima: The MBA is a supercar??? More like a smartcar, something that works for some people, isn't impressive in any way other than size and efficiency (by efficiency, I mean a smartcar is good on gas, and the MBA has a good battery life), but it definitely isn't a supercar. A supercar, in terms of laptops, would be something like an Alienware, the HP HDX Entertainment notebook or a Dell XPS. That's because the specs on those machines are really nice, but they are definitely huge and heavy in comparison to the MBA (especially the HP laptop, it's around 15 pounds!)

Crazysamz

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

macwin — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:26:53 EST

The real question is... why were the Japanese taking apart an American built Mac?
Were they trying to copy the design again just like what they did to the Jeep Cherokee before they build their first SUV?

macwin

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Kaiser-Machead's LEGO WALL-E — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:25:47 EST

@CarbonatedWater: I found it to be sturdier than the Macbook. There's far less flex when you hold it, but I guess that's also because it's lighter.

Kaiser-Machead's LEGO WALL-E

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Beerad — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:25:33 EST

@jetexas: No, she's the one that will cram her cane up your ass if you think a permanent limp is funny.

Beerad

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Stegerva — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:25:30 EST

@AlphaUltima:
is screw soxs better?

btw
more things IN more WASTE in FUTURE
got IT now or NOOOT? duh!

Stegerva

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Xavoc — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:24:37 EST

@luciusad2004: Actually I've always marveled at the Japanese. The prototype of the Zero was delivered in pieces to the airfield in ox carts.

Xavoc

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

jetexas — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:24:36 EST

@dbx: Or the way they "waste" all those tasty whales while conducting "scientific research."

Oh wait, no, I guess they actually eat the whales.

jetexas

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Kaiser-Machead's LEGO WALL-E — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:24:03 EST

If they're so pent up about waste, why the fuck do their cartoon robots have so many superfluous hydraulic and electrical cables all over the place?????

Kaiser-Machead's LEGO WALL-E

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

CarbonatedWater — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:23:16 EST

Well if it's as sturdy as my Macbook or at least close then I'd rather have more screws instead of it costing less. I learned that a tough laptop is worth it when it's dropped no thanks to my friend. And from years of experience with Macs, they are of superior build quality and I've never had a problem shelling out the extra cash for one.

CarbonatedWater

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

poisonfist — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:22:16 EST

After reading the article in Japanese, I think the English translation make the engineers sound more harsh and criticizing than they actually were. They are truly perplexed by the overbuild of the Air, they feel that the same results (rigidity, structural integrity) can be had with less than half of the screws and components not as robust on parts where there won't be too much strain.

poisonfist

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

dbx — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:21:06 EST

The Japanese have no call to discuss "waste" given their penchant for triple-layered packaging that weighs more than the product it's supposed to contain.

dbx

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

jetexas — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:20:26 EST

@Beerad: Is your the girlfriend the chick from the joke where the dad says, "I'm just thankful you didn't leave her hanging in the tree!"?

jetexas

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

fastm3driver — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:19:15 EST

I said it before(You can read it in my second comment in the linked article) Talk to a engineer not a journalist(blogger) for technical information on a product. As a engineer the air seems like a joke when compared to all the hype.
It's very heavy for the lack of options. It is was 2 lbs or had everything the R200 or M1330 had and was 3 lbs, then I'd be impressed.

fastm3driver

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

wildness — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:18:19 EST

Since converting to Apple computers, one of the things I have noticed is the SUPERIOR quality of the construction.

Maybe Japanese computer companies should take lessons from Apple AND their Japanese cousins in the auto industry - I know that Toyota doesn't let the assembly plant re-engineer the design of their cars with less screws.

wildness

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

luciusad2004 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:16:11 EST

I guess 12 useful screws is better than having functionless screws just for the sake of aesthetics. *cough*Macbook*cough* Maybe the put the screws that they left out of the macbook in to the macbook air.

But i really love the high and mighty "fuck those goes in japan" attitude some of you guys have. As though you know better. Or as though they don't know anything about tech because their Japanese... yeah, because that makes a lot of sense.

luciusad2004

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

illutionz — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:14:56 EST

Well, Japanese are known for being very efficient in cutting cost of production especially in their plants (factories). I know that Japanese engineers came to an automobile plants here in the US and reduce the output time from 2 weeks down to way less than 1 day...

illutionz

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Beerad — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:13:53 EST

@AlphaUltima: "the mba is a supercar. It's not for everyone. It's for pompous richies or desperate trendsetters in debt."

My girlfriend got one because she wanted a laptop that would interface nicely with our iMac, she doesn't know much about computers and wanted one that was easy to use, and is disabled so she can't carry around anything heavy. She makes under $40,000 per year in New York City.

Which category does she fall into, asshat?

Beerad

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

rohan1 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:09:56 EST

@rdldr1: Maybe they don't work for Sony.

rohan1

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

workingonyourinvoice — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:07:45 EST

@ANoel: You might wanna clean them off first, and if you need some ideas, PM me. They've worked out great for me.

workingonyourinvoice

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

aseriesoftubes — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:06:16 EST

Isn't the MBA assembled in Taiwan? Sounds like sour grapes on the part of the Japanese engineering firm.

And hey, Giz commenters, there's no need to get all uppity about the number of screws in a laptop.

That said, I'm in the more is more camp on this particular issue.

aseriesoftubes

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

tucker — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:05:01 EST

what-ev you 20-20 hindsight, monday mroning quarterback engineers.

"Jimmy Page didn't write 'Stairway to Heaven' until he was 23. I could play it when i was 12." - Vim

tucker

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Onouris — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 17:02:46 EST

@shorty63136:

You actually don't know the difference between China and Japan, do you?

Onouris

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

seltsamnaivling — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:57:22 EST

@officeboy: I'd rather 12 screws... especially if it's an American made car.

seltsamnaivling

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

GiltProto — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:56:47 EST

That's why they call it a work order.

Say, are they phillips or torx screws? Maybe those engineers were just upset because they had the wrong type of scredriver.

GiltProto

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

AlphaUltima — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:56:45 EST

this is like comparing super cars against economic cars. the mba is a supercar. it's not for everyone. it's for pompous richies or desperate trendsetters in debt. if you see any child carrying this you are morally entitled to rob that kid blind. And honestly I'm not going to trust a country that screws love dolls as a hobby. pun unintentional.

AlphaUltima

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Anhizer — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:56:36 EST

I'm a manufacturing engineer and from the japanese standpoint waste is identified as extra steps to produce (not necc. extra parts). From the 60/70's on the TPM (toyoa production model) is being used in most high end manufacturing environments. Im not sure how much the extra screws will add in terms of product longevity or robustness, but I do know that the operators involved and the time it takes to put those screws in is costly. Even if you needed 12 hold down points there are other alternatives to screws that can be cheaper. If screws are required, they can also be used for multiple items; I.E. holding the case together also holds down a circuitboard, etc. Again, im not sure that this is a viable alternitive, im just commenting on the 'wastes' that are referenced in the article.

Anhizer

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Xavoc — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:55:41 EST

@ANoel: Oh, ok. Carry on then!

Xavoc

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Biggy — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:54:27 EST

Nice new look for comment posts. :)

Biggy

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

ctthoqqua — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:53:54 EST

My five-year-old Powerbook G4 disagrees with the need for fewer screws. Not a dent or scratch or twist in it.

How many laptops have you bought in five years?

ctthoqqua

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

rdldr1 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:53:51 EST

Those Japanese who made those comments, rather than criticize Apple's design -- why dont they design something better? Also, the MacBook Air is in its first generation. Of course in FUTURE REVISIONS the Air will be more efficiently manufactured.

If they are SO DAMN SMART why didnt they make a more efficiently manufatured, less expensive Playstation 3 in its first generation?

rdldr1

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

brian1cj — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:53:39 EST

@ideaman2020: Oh man, I love lug nuts!!!

brian1cj

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

daftrok — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:53:18 EST

Fucking Air...

daftrok

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

ANoel — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:53:18 EST

@Xavoc:
It was me.
I took them for my sexperiments.
I can't say anymore.

ANoel

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Xavoc — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:52:23 EST

@ANoel: Well, people here are always talking about how you get screwed by Apple's pricing for their hardware...

Xavoc

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

matto — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:50:23 EST

And this is one of the reasons why Apple hardware is worth a premium in cost. Isn't it nice buying a product where you know the manufacturerer actually had to bother to use all the screws to assemble it; instead of just the ones that were convenient?

matto

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

ANoel — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:49:24 EST

Let no man say that Apple doesn't give you more screws for the buck.

ANoel

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Xavoc — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:48:50 EST

@workingonyourinvoice: You stole the rubber bands from your shelf didn't you...

Xavoc

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

bobide — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:48:46 EST

I trust the planet's industrial engineer, will likely wants to update the design to a simplier, faster, easier one.

bobide

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

draconis2941 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:47:56 EST

@Falconfire: and you'll end paying $1300 for a $800 laptop.

It's been the Japanese engineering tradition of reducing costs and waste that has made them a international business power.

draconis2941

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

whootowl — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:47:48 EST

Not like Apple tries to compete on cost/price anyway. Besides, Chinese communist slave labor hardly factors into the equation. The Japanese would have robots applying the screws.

whootowl

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Xavoc — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:47:24 EST

More != Better

That having been said.

Less != Better

and sometimes

More == Worse

along with

Less == Worse

Now, define better: More profitable, just as secure while being more profitable, or more secure.

Xavoc

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

workingonyourinvoice — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:47:00 EST

@ideaman2020: My tires are held on by prayers and rubberbands.

workingonyourinvoice

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

shorty63136 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:46:08 EST

And if it's gonna hold my MacBook together better than without - leave the damn screws.

shorty63136

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

workingonyourinvoice — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:46:04 EST

I think I agree with the Japanese on this one. As much as I want to like the MBA, it just seems like they took this idea of smallest. notebook. evar. and ran with it, but they just kept running and running and running, until they couldn't run any more. Run Jon, Run!! And by the time they finished, they obviously lost sight of some key objectives while focusing too hard on the WOW! factor. Or, should I say, the BOOM! factor.
I would happily walk around with the second, or even third smallest laptop on the market, as long as its merits make up for the lack of cutting edge design.

workingonyourinvoice

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

jetexas — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:45:31 EST

I agree with the Japanese. Everytime I take something apart, I put it back together with half the screws.

jetexas

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

shorty63136 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:45:30 EST

Hm. Their idea of less screws = more children that choke on your "cost-reduced" and lead-contaminated toys.

Take your extra screws and put em in your head.

shorty63136

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

aec007 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:43:40 EST

I just comes to show you that EVERYTHING can be improved.

Even a MAC.

aec007

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

ideaman2020 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:42:48 EST

@officeboy: My tires are held on by 5.

ideaman2020

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Falconfire — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:41:41 EST

@officeboy: When it comes to electronics, I would rather the product have 12 screws holding it together, than 4 thank you very much.

Falconfire

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

poppy — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:34:50 EST

Hmm. Mine is full of win. At least the hard drive is.

poppy

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

officeboy — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:34:20 EST

These are japanese engineers, not chinese engineers.
Cost reductions don't mean a worse product, it just means less waste.
Would you feel better if your tires were held on by 12 lug nuts instead of just 4? I guess you might if you bought a mac.

officeboy

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

fupa — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:32:27 EST

thats why I like to cut corners.

fupa

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Jason — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:31:47 EST

fewer screws.... countable nouns use fewer.

less salt

fewer grammar nazis.

Jason

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Earthslide — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:31:06 EST

Take the good review and combine it with the bad review = it's ok ;)

Earthslide

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Stang70Fastback — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:27:44 EST

Ahhhh... the REAL reason why a Dell falls apart while a Macbook doesn't...

Stang70Fastback

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

Slartibartfast — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:26:10 EST

fewer screws

Slartibartfast

Japanese Engineers: MacBook Air Insides Are "Full of Waste"

DeadWriter — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 16:23:46 EST

Cutting costs doesn't always improve the final product.

DeadWriter