Gizmodo
Is it reasonable to expect a company to update drivers for a new operating system if an all-in-one printer is only four years old? We'd think so, but HP is having none of this for their Officejet 6110. When Matt asked HP for updated drivers for OS X Leopard, HP told him that printing will still work, but scanning was out of the question (unless he previously updated from a 10.3 or 10.4 system with the scanning software already installed). HP did say that he could trade in his printer for $16, which actually isn't all that bad for a four-year-old model.
But here's the problem. Printers don't get outdated nearly as fast as computers, and as long as it's still working, you expect it to still be supported within a reasonable time frame. Four years is reasonable. HP's updated this particular model number for Vista, which is actually also a problem since many users have cited printer driver compatibility as a reason why they don't want to update to Vista.
In Matt's case, there are some open source drivers and scanning suites available so he can get scanning to work under Leopard. It may require a bit of trial and error, since open source drivers/suites aren't exactly as install-and-forget as the official ones, but it beats having to buy a new printer. [Consumierst]
Comments
I don't think it's unreasonable for HP to NOT update drivers for a 4 yr old printer. Now I don't know how difficult it is to update drivers from a programming aspect, but I imagine there are VERY few people using that specific model on a MAC using Leopard. I mean, compared to Vista, that has to be a very small number of users, I'm sure HP thought (knows) the same thing and decided it wasn't worth the hassle and time to pay someone to do it.
just because printers are selling for nothing these days because of ink markups, still doesn't justify not making updated drivers (greenpeace wont like the unnecessary waste this thinking causes).
there are numerous 3rd party hardwares out there does not support leopard, Gizmodo gonna list them one by one?
Whew, glad my HP Deskjet D2360 works for Leopard. Had it for a while now.
I think that if HP wants to retain customers for the long-term, they must do everything they can to help them and resolve the specific types of issues that arise during and OS update.
I had major issues with my HP printer when upgrading to Leopard. My printer is only two years old. Not only did HP refuse to offer any assistance, the software that they offered to make their printer operate under Leopard caused major system issues with my Mac.
I not only needed to remove the HP software, but ended up doing a complete erase and install to make Leopard function properly.
It costs a large corporation hundreds of dollars to attract and persuade a new customer to become a user of their products.
HP's position that a customer must purchase a new printer, when their present printer is functioning perfectly for the sole reason of HP's unwillingness to practice sound customer service.
HP is creating conditions where they are losing long-term customers. They are cutting their customers off at the knees in the belief that they will remain customers and buy a new printer that will operate with Leopard. Why would anyone purchase a new printer with HP knowing that HP will not be their for them as expected.
I realized that HP does not care about customer service and retention.
I took their advice and purchased a new printer; from a competitor. I will never purchase a product again from HP. There arre simply too many options for any consumer to be treated in this manner.
By the way, I am involved in making technology purchasing decision for a very large public school system. Does HP think that this experience will influence my recommendation to continue making HP purchases. Schools need to know that the equipment they purchase will fully function for several years.
I'm sure there are Epson, Dell, and Lexmark printers that don't work on Leopard (or even Tiger for that matter). There's really no need to single out one printer from one company. If Apple wants everything to be compatible for its Mac users they should pay the companies to do so.
Wow, that sux. I guess I am lucky since I have that exact model upgraded my OS and scanning still works. The printer software manager refuses to quit after printing something, but that's tolerable.
Godamn. When MS releases an OS and there are no drivers for a 3 year old printer, everyone blames MS, but when a 3 Year old printer is not supported in the lastest Apple OS, it's HP's fault? I didn't see many people blaming Nvidia when their older vid cards worked terribly in Vista, Noooo, it was MS's fault.
If you upgrade to the newest OS on any platform, expect hardware incompatibilities.
Jason: Consumierst? Little typo there.
Also, with regards to this, I have been on the receiving end of driver non-support (wireless router and 64-bit OS over a year ago) and open source is definitely the way to go.
Anything over 3 years old is subject to termination.
Otherwise check the compatibility list before upgrading.
M
Heh, funny thing; I own an HP that dates back to the same time frame (Officejet 4215), and I just switched to Ubuntu, which automatically detected it and installed it just fine, fax drivers and all. Funny how everybody says Linux has the worst hardware compatibility out there... haven't found anything yet that wasn't installed and automatically configured. :)
There is a bigger story here -- namely, the printer works just fine if the software is installed under Tiger, and then the system is upgraded to Leopard... so what's keeping HP from simply tweaking the installer to run on Leopard? I'll tell you what -- desire to get you to buy a new printer with new "safeguards" against remanufactured cartridges. This is a pretty crappy thing for HP to do, and here's hoping they come to their senses -- I go with them over the likes of Lexmark because they don't usually pull these kind of stunts.
This isn't unusual for HP to tell you tough luck, buy a new one. The first (and last) HP Printer/Scanner/Copier I bought decided ~45 days after purchase that the supplied color ink cartridge wasn't the correct one for that printer. Simple as that. It wasn't empty, just the wrong one. I called them up and they said, 'oh yeah, it's been known to do that, we've started shipping it with a different cartridge. You'll need to just purchase the new one." Seriously? That was it. Didn't even offer a coupon or discount or anything. I now have a Lexmark sitting in my office.
I was also told the same thing with my HP PSC 2510, but I was able to get mine to work.
[discussions.apple.com]
I'd suggest Matt check out the thread I just linked to above. It worked for me and others for another HP printer. It required me to uninstall my HP stuff, copy the installer off the DMG and reinstall - with a few restarts in between.
Congrats to HP. Another reason not to buy one of their printers. As far as Vista compatibility...We've had to purchase 3 systems in the last year...and decided to go with Dell because we could still get XP pre-loaded. We knew that our existing printers/scanners/drives/etc. would still work with these new additions to our environment. Unfortunately, buying Dell means that in order to address any tech issues...you need a translator, and must put up with support that is often dismal (at best).
4 years old!!!
I'd have to say get a new printer as well, I'd blame Apple to be honest, they should've made it backwards compatible with the 10.4 drivers...
Oki Data has yet to release a Leopard driver for my C3200N color laser printer. I went without a printer for several months, until I was able to get the Tiger driver to work with a workaround.
I have a Brother Laser MFC that is older than that HP. Not only does it still work fine with the latest version of Leopard, the drivers are included with the OS. It is entirely possible for a company to standardize on a driver model so that this kind of obsolescence doesn't happen.
Think that's bad? I've got an OfficeJet 5510 and HP refuses to write new drivers for Vista. Yeah, Vista. How nuts is that?
Their driver download lets you print, but you have to scan out of Paint or Windows Photo Gallery.
How is this different to the MS situation? It does seem that apple is getting a bit different treatment in the media.
Is it coz apple finally have a substantial user base and are now finding out how difficult it is to support a large number of users?
As far as HP and Vista, they also refused to re-write the driver for the HP-3030 multifunction. Maybe HP isn't as good as it wants to be. A reputation is a really bad thing to lose in this economy.
HP is a giant company with a large marketshare, but I always feel that their motto in terms of compatibility is always "we're working on it". Don't get me wrong...when HP hardware is working, it's working really nice, but when there's a bug/flaw, it's a huge pain in my ass. They really keep their customers and customers of customers (read: IT support) in the dark ITO what's being done to resolve conflicts, and that just extends onto everyone affected.
@mcg1969:
I don't think it's the printer driver that's the issue, but more that the scanning part doesn't work.
[docs.info.apple.com]
there's an extensive list of printer drivers on that page (included is the OP's HP 6110). This is more of a scanning program issue which you can easily blame both apple and HP.
Seriously-Leopard supports the apple LaserWriter and Canon BJC series...now that shit's old!
ed1chandler go check [h10025.www1.hp.com] and you will find your vista drivers for your OJ5510. Oh, BTW they DO write drivers for vista, you just need to know where to look (maybe on the manufacturers website - how hard is that?). I think you owe HP an apology for throwing them under the bus.
For this reason and many others before it, HP products are not compatible with my money.
bummer... I own an officejet 5510 too, and I am going to install Vista on my new Mac Pro arriving in 10 days or so... so it means I'll need to get a new printer!??? I hate to have to throw it away as its still working very well.
I have this printer, am running Leopard and managed to install this. Instead of running the main installer, you need to manually run each individual installer (that the main installer would normally run).
Tedious, but I was able to scan, etc, after doing this.
btw, which company has a better track record? I don't think I want to buy another HP again now and then another one when the next Mac OS X update comes out...
i read it a few times... seems to be the printer drivers will work just fine.
just that the various 650MB of HP utilities and button managers and startup items and nagging annoying crap you need to install in order to use one of those godawful "All-In-One" devices doesn't work.
pretty big difference. "All-In-One" printers generally do none of the included tasks very well. yet are the most finicky and pissy about drivers and needed tons of literal crap installed in order to function. lowest common denominator devices for consumers that fail to do any research. "only $119 for *ALL* these features?!! how could i *possibly* go wrong?!"
i have plenty ... PLENTY... of HP printers that are well over 4 years old that continue to work perfectly fine under Leopard. the one in my personal office is nearing (maybe over?) 10 years old. oddly enough i also have NUMEROUS stand-alone USB scanners that work perfectly fine under Leopard.
and yes... as a matter of fact... i AM tired of dealing with the wonky piles of junk known as AIOs. one of them killed my dog and then violated my sister.
Pff they do the same for Windows Vista Drivers...
My HP printer purchased in 2006, and released in 2006, is STILL pending for Vista 32 and 64-bit drivers (no WinXP 64-bit drivers exists).
The only reason why my printer works now, is because Microsoft made the drivers for Vista 64-bit FOR THEM.
My printer property says "HP LaserJet 1010 series, By Microsoft" and support page: "http://www.microsoft.com"
When I called HP for Vista 64-bit drivers, they instantly start presenting me with other newer, Vista compatible, laser printer that uses the SAME ink, and is IDENTICAL in specification.. and I do mean IDENTICAL, I double checked. The only difference is that the drivers for their suggested printer for me to purchase contains a system that has the drivers encrypted, and only if it can detect the proper printer it can de-encrypt them and get installed. Oh and the plastic color has changed. All this complication because they want people to buy new HP printer.
Well screw them! I am never NEVER going to touch a other HP product ever again, no mater what.
I just remembered that my HP OfficeJet 6110 scanner works fine w/PhotoShop and Graphic Converter so maybe all Matt needs to do is extract the TWAIN driver and use another program.
@Lizard_King: Thank you! Someone who sees objectively!
I gave up printing a couple of years ago....
Who cares. Lexmark won't write a Vista driver for my X125 printer.
These companies are lazy scum. They just dont get it. I just dropped a g on a new printer and right off the top, any Lexmark printers were out of the question. If they cant support the one I got, why the hell would I buy from them again??
@Lizard_King: exactly.
but i'm still trying to understand why any Mac user even has a printer....i guess it is nice to have a hard copy of your latest zany storyboard or wacky photos you edited.
4 years?!? Ancient!
Seriously, old MF devices are usually really cheap (inexpensive) and hardly make any margin in sales. There is absolutely NO incentive to keep owners of such devices happy or to try to update drivers to keep a model alive.
@chrisaroz: I have an OfficeJet 6110 here at home and would like to use it on our Mac Mini, but we've not yet upgraded to Leopard, and this is another reason why.
HP has totally lost my business over the past few years. Their shenanigans, ranging from time-limited printer cartridges (stop working on a certain date even if there's still usable ink remaining) to shoddy software with bad user interfaces to overcharging for what is essentially commodity hardware, have left me totally devoted to buying anything BUT their printers. And I've been completely satisfied (actually, amazed) by the Canon Pixma MP830 I bought last year, so HP has no chance in hell of getting my printer business back.
And this crap about drivers just further cements my decision.
As long as I'm a Mac user I will never buy another HP product. It's ridiculous how difficult it's been. My HP scanner, significantly less than four years old, does not work on an Intel Mac--not just Leopard, but Tiger too. That's just inane.
@HeartBurnKid: I'll tell you one piece of hardware that wasn't configured automatically, my freaking soundcard. A soundblaster 24bit 5.1, and even when I did get it working with some forms of linux it would cut out every now and then.
No, OS is completely hardware compatibility with everything.
I actually have grown rather tired of HP - their printers are always kick ass - but getting help from them is ridiculous, and their Mac support is so-so. Yes, they make drivers and yes most of their products work, but it's usually half-assed. I went to get a high speed document scanner from them and there was NO mac support. This led me to discover Fujitsu for scanning and I'll never use HP again.
What really blew me away with HP was looking at their color lasers. To purchase new toner in all the colors (CMYK) was MORE than the printer is brand new, NOT on sale.
That was the final straw for me - I went Samsung and Canon for printing and I will never buy another HP product again.
@jnriga: :Printers from most manufacturers are, you should pardon the expression, a crapshoot. I used nothing but Epsons for years, because they were among the few manufacturers who didn't take the lazy way out and make winprinters. Some of the Espson dot matrix printers will probably survive to the end of the world. The Epson laser printer was a short-lived piece of junk, though.
Now I have an HP inkjet (just because there was a good sale on HPs going on when my last Epson inkjet woofed its cookies) and a Brother laser. It will cost me almost the same price as a new printer to add one lousy extra paper tray to the Brother.
HP's tech support was really good back in the days when I was selling computers. Then they went into a steep decline. I tried their live chat tech help yesterday when I wanted to install a larger hard drive in my 4-year-old HP Pavilion notebook and couldn't get the drive tray out--turns out there is an extra screw that's covered by a hard-to-find rubber plug--and it took three tries to get the answer (the first because their chat software does not work with Firefox). So I'd say they have only partly recovered.
@chrisaroz:
how hard is it to write printer drivers, come on now. it's not like it's an Adobe application.
@Christibyte: My first comment was more a flippant remark, but I've said it before on the PC side.
What responsibility does HP have to providing a printer/scanner driver for something that came out years ago? The new OS broke the printer compatibility, Apple changed something. Why should HP have to spend man-hours developing drivers for an EOL product when working in future OSes is never guaranteed for products when you buy them.
HP lived up to their bargain if the printer worked in the OSes it was advertised on which to run. Was this printer advertised to run on Leopard? NO?!?! Then why would you EXPECT that?
I agree that HP is a mere shell of the company it used to be, but damn, get a new $100 AIO.
HP is always behind in drivers vs Mac OS. Just a fact of life.
Hi guys. I just upgraded my Powerbook from Mac OS 10.2 to Leopard. I didn't upgrade to Panther or Tiger first. All of a sudden, I could no longer print to my HP 4215xi all-in-one (exactly four years old) via my wireless network. I called HP and they gave me the song and dance about how my all in one is too old and I should buy a new one. I tried reloading the original driver from the original HP install cd (2.2.9). Nothing. Then I read an article about the drivers that come with Leopard. They're called Gutenprint print drivers. I was reading an article that said that sometimes after installing these Gutenprints, you have to reset the spool. You do that by turning sharing off. You can turn it back on afterwards or leave it off. It won't matter. I did this and all of a sudden, I was able to print over my network again. I don't know if I'm using the Gutenprint driver or the original driver HP says isn't compatible with Leopard. But either way, nothing was working til I reset the spool. Just a tip worth trying.
Product life cycle.
The end.
While this is irritating check THIS out.
I bought a new laptop from HP...17", vista ultimate blah blah (yes I know, big mistake). I spent a couple hours trying to get my network printer (an HP 722) to install on it...and it just will not work. I call HP, then run me through a couple hours of repeating the same shit I already did. End of the day I find the answer on a microsoft newsgroup, that the printer will not work on 64 bit vista. Now, one would have thought that HP, as the supplier of both the printer AND the laptop would have been aware of this, but nope...waste of life spent troubleshooting an unresolvable issue.
I hate HP. Sent that POS back, and bought a macbook - much happier.
@bbfreak: When was this, and what distro did you use? I have an SB Live, and had no issues under Ubuntu Gutsy.
And just to prove I'm just being a cocky git, shortly after I posted that, I discovered that there was something that didn't get configured quite right; namely, my off-brand 5-button mouse was only set up as a 3-button. A little thing, but I guess I should be more careful what I say... :)
@Lizard_King: Because it'd be relatively few man-hours (remember, both the drivers and the software are known to work if it's installed in Tiger and then upgraded to Leopard, so all that would need to be changed is for the installer to recognize Leopard, and then perhaps a little testing), and it'd make customers happy and reduce waste? As well as making them more likely to go back to HP when their printer does go kaput?
Because, personally, if I were in this situation, and I knew that HP was likely to pull support for my printer once it gets a few years under its belt, I'd likely make sure my next printer were a Canon or Epson or the like -- but definitely not HP.
Long-term support is a key part of any customer relationship, at least any good one. I know it's hard to comprehend in the Wal-Mart Generation, but some people actually like things that last and companies that stand behind their products.
@HeartBurnKid: Oh, I try only to buy standards and buy for the long haul. My Laserjet 4L and Scanjet 4P (both over 11 years old) work in Vista and Leopard (though I run Tiger). The Scanner is using a Linksys PPSX-1 Print server. If when I upgraded to a new OS, these items did not work, then I would not be upset in the slightest. However, they continue working, and I contiune using them. They were both expensive units when new, and built with quality.
Apple changed the way the printer/scanner was handled. Like my original comment stated, I would blame Apple. HP played by the rules, Apple changed the entire game.