Gizmodo
If you are planning on picking up an HDTV in the near future, HD Guru's list of the 10 worst HDTV ripoffs for 2008 is required reading—pure and simple. Chances are, many consumers have already heard about the issue with HDMI cables—which is probably one of the biggest scams of all time (right up there with Q-Ray ionized bracelets and the Ionic Breeze). Other scams, like the one involving contrast ratio specifications are also making their way into the public consciousness.
However, there are still plenty of pitfalls that the novice consumer needs to avoid before making the commitment to drop a serious amount of cash on a new HDTV. The list summary is as follows:
•Fake HD and Cable Satellite Channels: Did you know that a number of HD channels broadcast a lot of "fake HD?" Anyone who has ever watched some of TNT's HD broadcasts can attest to that.
•Dynamic Contrast Ratio Measurement Specification: The contrast ratio number is basically meaningless.
•Line Conditioners: They do nothing to improve the HDTV image.
•Deep Color: No deep color sources makes this a worthless feature.
•x.v.Color: Until Laser TVs and xv Color HD discs appear on the scene, this feature is not truly useful.
•1080p HDTVs below 42" (diagonal): If you own a HDTV under 42", chances are you won't recognize the quality difference over 720p—unless you are standing really close to the TV.
•Flat LCD HDTVs 26" and Smaller: The image quality of LCD HDTVs in the 26" inch range or lower is generally poor.
•120Hz HDMI Cables: As mentioned before, expensive HDMI cables are a huge ripoff. Case in point, decent HDMI cable for less than $2. I bought a few myself and they work fine.
•Off Brand Model HDTVs: No-name brands may cost you more down the line.
•HDMI: Horrible connector design can prove problematic. Always pretest your connections.
So there you have it. If you do your homework, you can save yourself a lot of problems (and money) down the line. For a full explanation on the items in this list, check out the HD Guru link. [HD Guru]
Comments
The irony is, that guy spent $1500 on those shades and another $3K for the chains.
@92BuickLeSabre: They were gifts at the AVN awards.... Wait a minute, that's not Ron Jeremy. Impostor!
If you go into the TV section of Fry's, the HDMI cables cost $100. If you go over to the computer section where the USB, DVI and RGB cables are, there's HDMI cables starting at $15.
I ordered two of Amazon.com for $2 a piece, but they charged me $12 shipping, which I thought was a bit excessive.
Hey, that guy sold me a psystar!
Good story though, I had no idea that HDMI was so unreliable.
Whats wrong with the Ionic Breeze
@GeekyNerdGuy:
I remember going to Best Buy and tey wanted $90 for a HDMI cable. Fucking hell.
I remeber last year trying to get a DVI to HDMI cable so I could hook up mac to my TV. The kid at Best Buy told me that was impossable because the and I quote "worked on different frequncies". I ended finding the cable myself, but it was like 120 bucks... I passed, and ended up picking on up at walmart for about 15.
@GeekyNerdGuy: @cubensis: monoprice.com = cable heaven
NICE
@cubensis: Consumer Reports did tests with them and they actually make the air WORSE.
@cubensis: Buy something with a HEPA filter.
WoooHoo!! We crashed the HD Guru server!!!
Irony hits this post. I followed the link to the amazon.com page and placed an order for three HDMI cables at $0.13 cents per cable with $4.80 shipping. After confirming the oder at checkout I saw they charged me $4.80 in shipping PER cable, and not a flat fee. Keep an eye out. It's still a good price for cabling, but the shiping is outrageous.
My Canon Camcorder has a mini-HDMI connection. That's annoying as hell. I had to go track down yet another cable to hook it to my TV, and that connection is really finicky. It looks better running from the A/V outs.
My bro-in-law swears by HDMI though, and he a stereo/DVD player with nothing but HDMI between all the components and the TV. I was trying to explain the benefits of him going to a home theater PC since they're about to upgrade, but as nobody seems to offer PCs with audio out in HDMI format, he refuses.
@Tayng: HDMI and DVI are the SAME THING. All you actually need is a DVI to HDMI adapter on a standard DVI cable.
PS> DVI = no sound
Thankfully the 1080p bit was on there. I own 46 sammy 1080p and still believe the difference from 720 to 1080p is negligible. Unless the tv is a deal as mine was. The 120mhz was easy to ripoff to detect as well. At stores they'll show splitscreen video of 120 and 60 -and despite their attempt I couldn't tell.
@kahri: Open Mac? What's that?
You, sir, are awarded one Internet.
I hate HDMI and DVI. Well, DVI works great on computers, but it's problematic for TVs.
@reddingofish: ...and two minutes later, it's back. Slashdot, we ain't. :P
@GeekyNerdGuy: Yeah, poor audio is the crux of HTPC fandom these days. It's so weird-- even finding good dedicated receivers that support all the new standards is difficult-- most support one, but not another. We need more agreed-on standards, and fewer 'standards'.
I used to have a JVC HD-ILA tv that had one HDMI input, purchased in late 2005. When I connected my PS3 in 2007, the HDMI connection didn't work properly - no video. I never solved the problem, as the PS3 worked fine via HDMI on the Samsung LCD in my bedroom.
My newly refreshed living room is all HDMI: one HDMI cable connecting a Panasonic plasma to a Sony 5.1 receiver. All of my other components (PS3, Comcast HD cablebox, etc.) connect to the receiver via HDMI, with no video or audio problems.
I chalk up my earlier TV's HDMI issues with the fact it was just that: too early. But am I just a lucky one with my new setup? I never tested a thing before mounting. Is there really still a compatibility issue surrounding HDMI? If so, sad . . . and I need to stop recommending to my friends to do as I did without testing first.
@GeekyNerdGuy actually HP has a media center that streams the audio through the HDMI.. I believe it has the Nvidia 8600 with HDMI out.. the spdif cable needs to be attached from the motherboard to the card.
@SeattleTed the only good thing 120htz is good for is 3d gaming/movies providing 60 frames per eye per second allowing for stutter free 3d
Most popular scam quote a salesman will tell you: "If you're going to invest so much on your TV, why go cheap on cables?"
One word:
Monster Cables
thanks for the insights. I will print this list out when i go to circuit city next time!
There are cards out there for HTPCs that will merget digital audio and video into an HDMI output, but they are pretty new. I do like the simplicity of HDMI, but totally concede that it has had growing pains. monoprice.com sells a normal to mini HDMI cable
after many config. attempts, my current setup works for me:
laptop to LCD - VGA (audio=MBP line out)
satellite to LCD - composite
xbox360 & PS3 to LCD - HDMI via splitter
Deep Color: No deep color sources makes this a worthless feature.
Well, there is deep purple.
[en.wikipedia.org]
"•1080p HDTVs below 42" (diagonal): If you own a HDTV under 42", chances are you won't recognize the quality difference over 720p-unless you are standing really close to the tv."
This one assumes displaying a 720p signal on a 720p display vs. a 1080p signal on a 1080p display, and was a pure pixel size vs. eyeball resolution. If you mostly watch 1080p, the 1080p set will look better because there will be no scaling smearing pixels together.
@Castle1914:
I connect my mac mini to 3-4 tv's with DVI to HDMI, works great, dunno what your talkin bout' willis.
@shamoononon:
How about the ones made by by Oreck? My aunt has 2 of them, she is the one who told me about Orek but I went to a friends house last week and he swears by the Ionic Breeze. I will show him the articles though.
@grayskyz: Like I said works for computers. Still my macbook can't seem to get the resolution right. There are a few 3rd party apps to fix it but I haven't bothered to download them yet.
@cubensis: I think the Orecks are just a HEPA filter setup. The Ionic Breeze actually generates Ozone, which is not healthy and can be a strong irritant to some people.
I have two problems with this piece.
26" TVs can produce great quality images. Case in point, the Sony bravia TVs look amazing even at 26 inches. The thing is that you have to pick the right TV. Samsung TVs, contrary to Sony's, suck monkey balls at screen sizes up to and including 37". Atleast their LCDs ones do. Their Plasmas are usually a bit better.
And second. 1080P can be useful at under 42 inches. It all depends on how close to the TV you are. Even at 37" I can easily spot the difference. Just imagine this. 2 TVs standing next to each other in a small room. One is 26" at 720P and the other is 37" and also at 720P. You can't tell me you can't see a noticeable difference in sharpness and overall image quality.
The other 8 are indeed total crap. Especially the fake HD channels. If you can't do it right, don't do it at all. Unfortunately some networks don't seem to give a shit about their customers.
I am not 100% up on the issue, but these two reports should help:
[www.aircleaners.com]
[www.housekeepingchannel.com]
My daughter suffers from some bad air allergies so I have a few of the ones with the HEPA filters running quite a bit. They are more expensive, but I think in this case the cost is equal to the quality. I certainly notice a difference between my home and other peoples. I am not a clean freak either, so I have to give credit to the machines.
@GeekyNerdGuy: I don't believe they have HEPA filters, I think it's a knock off. I'll shut up now though.
as long as your motherboard has spdif out pins on it you can run sound through your graphics card. my 9600gt came with a free dvi - hdmi adapter. its very nice to be able to game in hd video and hd audio using only 1 cable from my pc to my surround sound, and then from the receiver to my hdtv.
@SeattleTed & Dave_T: I thought I read that 120mhz was nice because 24p goes evenly into 120mhz (as does 30p and 60i). So if you're watching a 30p or 60i source, as you may have been when you did your side-by-side comparison, you won't see the 24p benefit of 120mhz. Anyone want to weigh in if this is accurate?
@shamoononon: IDK either. I just have a Kenmore I picked up at Sears. Seems to work really well.
@Angus: I have Spdif on my motherboard's Realtek HD audio and I have an 8800GT with a DVI to HDMI adapter on it.
How do I connect the audio to the graphics card?????
Is there a website that explains this?
@Nathan Drake: Oops. A little correction:
Just imagine this. 2 TVs standing next to each other in a small room. One is 26" at 720P and the other is 37" and also at 720P. You can clearly see that the image on the 37" TV doesn't look as sharp. You can't tell me a Full HD 37 incher wouldn't give you a noticeable difference in sharpness and overall image quality.
On a side note. Can we, in the future, get an option so that we can edit our posts? It would be super useful ;)
hdmi cables? i went to CC one day for a fibre cable (toslink) and i had 2 options, 1 was $30 for 2 meters, the other was 5.99 for 2 meters AND it came with a SVHS cable. i took it to the counter to price check, the cashier confirmed the prices. with a puzzled look on my face she then stated
"I would buy the one with the SVHS if I were you"
not that i'll ever use svhs (i have a dozen of those sitting around at home already), but... damn
@tegronin: yeah with Toslink, the actual fiber used is a big difference. It may use inexpensive 1 mm plastic optical fiber or it can use higher quality multi-strand plastic optical fibers or even quartz glass optical fibers depending on the desired bandwidth and application.
@lordargent: And deep blue.
although, I'm not much of a chess player.
@kahri: this particular example, they were identical grades/cables. everythign was identical, i assume one set was an old stock at old pricing, the duo-set was probably a current pricing (i remember when it was $30 a meter)
Can't believe how people take advantage of the confusion. Buy this HD tv! Full HD plus small enough to fit into your bookshelf at only 11''
@kahri: dvi and hdmi are different cables,even though dvi and hdmi both are hd compatible dvi does not carry audio. hdmi carries at least 5.1 audio. if you were to connect your dvi connector to your hdmi you would not get any sound so, then you would use your toslink(fiberoptic) or your stereo rca's
"•1080p HDTVs below 42" (diagonal): If you own a HDTV under 42", chances are you won't recognize the quality difference over 720p-unless you are standing really close to the tv."
I have a Sony XBR4 40" and can absolutely see the difference between 720p and 1080p. And I am definitely not a super video snob.
Agreed with all who pointed out that 120hz makes gaming super slick.
@DaveTehWave says: One word: Monster Cables
One word: Rip off
@cubensis: The process the ionic breeze uses to move the air without any moving parts actually creates O3 which is also known as ozone. Although it helps this planet from harmful radiation, its in fact poisonous for humans.
I believe there was a huge thing when the info came out after being tested and there were "ozone filters" that were made to attach to the front of the unit, but its all BS. Try googling some pictures to see what the filter looked like and its this tiny plastic attachment. Pretty sad that so many people will believe anything you tell them.
TV mounts at the Box stores are just as outrageously priced as Monster Cables - why is there never a mention of TV mounts as a ripoff? Circuit City is selling one for $650!?!?
While I do not buy Monster Cables, I cannot condone or recommend the Monoprice cables after a few problem I've had. There is a better middle ground.
@GeekyNerdGuy: I'm not exactly sure where to find it but if you bought the card seperately from someone like Asus or AOpen or whoever, it might be in the product manual or might be available from their own website.
In addition to the "you don't want to spend all this money and skimp on the cables" line I often hear the "now you'll need a power line cleaner, something like this $250 Monster Power Strip." I'd like to see a study on that.
@Lizard_King: eBay is your friend there. I picked up a Full Motion Sanus mount for just over $150.
HDMI cables come in to play with length. I tried to do 50' and I only get picture if I plug in with a short HDMI cable, then switch it to the 50'. If I turn off and back on, there is not picture. Im returning my 50' to newegg and getting a 50' from DVIgear for triple the price. =(
Another thing they should have added to the list is the 1366x768 resolution.
Many HDTVs that says it supports 720p and 1080i isn't displaying them natively.
Instead its basically upscaling 720p to 1366x768 and downscaling 1080i to 1366x768.
The 1080i source would look better on those TVs because its downscaling a high resolution source.
However when upscaling 720p, Your bound to noticed some pixelation.
When I got my HDTV I had my buddy at Best Buy buy it on discount. I think th RocketFish cable I picked out was "only" $60 retail (what a steal), and about $5 after discount. I know I overpaid, but the extra couple of dollars was worth it to have it the same day. ;)
@GeekyNerdGuy: It's always fun to point that out to sales people at Fry's and ask them the difference. It's a almost coin flip between those that lie and try to justify a differnce and those who say " You are right, it's the same thing. " The older sales people always lie and most of the younger guys fold and tell the truth (quietly).
I got a 10' HDMI cable there for like $7 or $8.